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Premium Member
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
No offense, mods, but these new forum rules really seem to be stifling conversation. It’s the Everything Else, Eh threads that have been keeping this place alive over the years I would say. So many original posters have left, and very few have joined to replace them. Good conversation is not where everyone agrees on everything but rather where discussion happens even when people disagree. People can be respectful. Trolling is discouraged. The political and religious threads used to be interesting at one time. I fear we’ve thrown the baby out with the bath water now. Is that the outcome we really wanted to see?
 

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peek-a-boo
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17,352 Posts
As much as I enjoy a good debate in controversial topics, if I were the forum owner I’d be like yeah, that has worked so great the last near decade. Not. The trolling is off the charts and never ceases, and, from my perspective, ain’t gonna stop any time soon. That’s why there’s no one left! Most former members had had enough of that crap because nothing was done about it, and I don’t know that anything will ever be done about it. I think it was given a near decade with a few members to show it would generate activity and well, that’s a failure. The only way controversial topics work, is if it’s tightly moderated and trolling is dealt with, otherwise, whether or not so and so ignores that one or not, it will end up in a squabble with someone else. All the time. As it has for years.

So, reluctantly, I’d say I don’t blame them. Sorry.

As it is, the only real value here isn’t the squabbling that has been here for the last 7 odd years, it’s the 20 year database of info that pulls searches in and ad impressions. Otherwise why would someone pay for server costs so a handful can squabble??
 

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Premium Member
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
As much as I enjoy a good debate in controversial topics, if I were the forum owner I’d be like yeah, that has worked so great the last near decade. Not. The trolling is off the charts and never ceases, and, from my perspective, ain’t gonna stop any time soon. That’s why there’s no one left! Most former members had had enough of that crap because nothing was done about it, and I don’t know that anything will ever be done about it. I think it was given a near decade with a few members to show it would generate activity and well, that’s a failure. The only way controversial topics work, is if it’s tightly moderated and trolling is dealt with, otherwise, whether or not so and so ignores that one or not, it will end up in a squabble with someone else. All the time. As it has for years.

So, reluctantly, I’d say I don’t blame them. Sorry.

As it is, the only real value here isn’t the squabbling that has been here for the last 7 odd years, it’s the 20 year database of info that pulls searches in and ad impressions. Otherwise why would someone pay for server costs so a handful can squabble??
Perhaps. I don’t know why the general public comes here, but I know why I come here. Looking for honest conversation. Not insults. Not trolling. I come here for the familiar posters and topics. There used to be lots of good conversation and all kinds of topics, not just updating operating systems. I don’t want to see the life sucked out of the place, but it seems like that’s where we may be headed. Moderation is important, but there’s a fine line between moderation and censorship. Another forum I like, the Straight Dope, strikes that balance and has a robust membership. All I’m saying is that it can be done.
 

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peek-a-boo
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17,352 Posts
Perhaps. I don’t know why the general public comes here, but I know why I come here. Looking for honest conversation. Not insults. Not trolling. I come here for the familiar posters and topics. There used to be lots of good conversation and all kinds of topics, not just updating operating systems. I don’t want to see the life sucked out of the place, but it seems like that’s where we may be headed. Moderation is important, but there’s a fine line between moderation and censorship. Another forum I like, the Straight Dope, strikes that balance and has a robust membership. All I’m saying is that it can be done.
If thats what you were looking for, well that would have been rare here. Thats why everyone left. If they roll it back to that, don't expect that anyone will return, certainly not for long. There's 7+ years of track record I wasn't around to demonstrate what that results in... There's that saying... "insanity is..." ;)
Please forgive my ignorance...but what are the new forum rules?
They curtailed the toxic political/religious threads. That was pretty much all that was left here. When they got rid of the mods years ago because someone's grand idea was it was the 'heavy handed mods' fault, well, this is the result. Its too bad, there was once decent chat, many years ago. But its been left to a few trolls that without any moderation destroyed this place. Sad.
 

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Administrator
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107 Posts
Please forgive my ignorance...but what are the new forum rules?
Here is a link to the updated forum rules. There is also a link in my signature


These rules are not any different than most forums out there. Well the forums that are moderated anyway. I understand that the majority of members here are used to an unmoderated forum for far too long, where you can say what you wanted to with no repercussions. So we have expected some push back when we implemented these rules. These rules are needed to try and move this forum back to the main topic of this forum. The main rule that we changed was no political and religious discussions. We have firearms in there too, but this being mostly a Canadian site, I don’t think we have to worry much about that. There are a ton of forums out there where you can discuss these topics. I’m sure there are lots just for Canadians also. These types of discussions bring a lot of arguments. Arguments that are not needed on a forum that is suppose to be discussing Macs/Apple products. In time, we are hoping that the emphasis on this forum will move away from the off topic sub forums, and to the topic at hand.

If any of you have any issues with the way something is moderated, please send a private conversation to @Peterweb and/or myself.
 

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Premium Member
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Which is not necessarily a bad thing when it is the heated discussions that get out of hand that have diminished. That is all we are trying to accomplish.
I appreciate that, Peterweb, and there are plenty of things to talk about beyond Macs and politics. We’ll see how this all shakes out.
 

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Registered
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848 Posts
We have specifically a chat group titled 'Anything else eh'

I interpret that to mean, anything goes. This is the issue with the society we live in today. 'You are free to voice your concerns and any other opinion as long as you agree with us' When we talk about toxic culture, it is that exact item that is toxic. I am a legal firearms owner, yet I can't talk about guns in our society? I'm not as active as I once was, but I still think I have a few hundred posts behind me. I've always viewed this site as a place to talk about anything mac. But hey interjecting and having a page dedicated to other topics or any off topic chatter is healthy too. But I don't blame the mods...they are following the narrative established by our political establishment. Diversity is our strength, we are all the same, we are all different, liberal left, can't offend anyone, trump is a racist, blah blah blah. No room for debate and for people to engage in free truly liberal ideas.

In fact, the basic tenants of a free and open society is where we can express our opinions and thoughts without prejudice and engage in deep intelligent discussions...but that is not the narrative that is in play now. The narrative is that we can only espouse ideas that are in agreement with the state and the social justice warriors. We build playgrounds with rubber mat, because heaven forbid a child gets a cut or breaks an arm. And this bubble wrapped notion has no infiltrated ehmac as well. 99% of time I'm here for mac related questions, but sometimes I like to peruse around, see what others are saying and get a good laugh. Perhaps i'll need to check to see if my laugh is approved by Mr. Trudeau before I engage.

Bottom line, there is nothing wrong with having a page dedicated to free thought. As a footnote, I do not believe that hate speech and hateful comments have any place in this forum, and if the moderators are modelling that and have specific guidelines for what is hate speech, i'm okay with that one type of control. I wonder if this post will be allowed
 

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peek-a-boo
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17,352 Posts
But far right wing opinions dominated here for years. Since most ended up leaving including myself (for over 7 years!), that's pretty much what was left. There were no mods, no one was suppressing anything. Im not sure what 'narrative' is controlling anything.

I miss having those threads to debate, but they were toxic, to be fair. They closed down the topics, not just one side. No narrative, no left wing conspiracy that I can see. Im a left wing socialist latte sipping pinko who lives in progressive downtown Toronto, and I can't participate in those threads either, lets be fair.

Though this left winger consorts with many gun toting conservative yeehaw pals just fine, so it is entirely possible for this to occur. Unfortunately it seems difficult here. I think the only way is tightly moderated but you would A) need someone who wishes to give of their time for that, and B) it isn't likely everyone will consider them impartial and there will always be complaints. As much as my desire is to have fun in those threads, I can't say I blame them.
 

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Premium Member
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42,901 Posts
Bottom line, there is nothing wrong with having a page dedicated to free thought. As a footnote, I do not believe that hate speech and hateful comments have any place in this forum, and if the moderators are modelling that and have specific guidelines for what is hate speech, i'm okay with that one type of control. I wonder if this post will be allowed
Some members see free speech as a right-wing construct. They were most eager for moderation, because they saw it as a means to shift the board to a centre-left ideology.
 

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Administrator
Joined
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107 Posts
We have specifically a chat group titled 'Anything else eh'

I interpret that to mean, anything goes. This is the issue with the society we live in today. 'You are free to voice your concerns and any other opinion as long as you agree with us' When we talk about toxic culture, it is that exact item that is toxic. I am a legal firearms owner, yet I can't talk about guns in our society? I'm not as active as I once was, but I still think I have a few hundred posts behind me. I've always viewed this site as a place to talk about anything mac. But hey interjecting and having a page dedicated to other topics or any off topic chatter is healthy too. But I don't blame the mods...they are following the narrative established by our political establishment. Diversity is our strength, we are all the same, we are all different, liberal left, can't offend anyone, trump is a racist, blah blah blah. No room for debate and for people to engage in free truly liberal ideas.

In fact, the basic tenants of a free and open society is where we can express our opinions and thoughts without prejudice and engage in deep intelligent discussions...but that is not the narrative that is in play now. The narrative is that we can only espouse ideas that are in agreement with the state and the social justice warriors. We build playgrounds with rubber mat, because heaven forbid a child gets a cut or breaks an arm. And this bubble wrapped notion has no infiltrated ehmac as well. 99% of time I'm here for mac related questions, but sometimes I like to peruse around, see what others are saying and get a good laugh. Perhaps i'll need to check to see if my laugh is approved by Mr. Trudeau before I engage.

Bottom line, there is nothing wrong with having a page dedicated to free thought. As a footnote, I do not believe that hate speech and hateful comments have any place in this forum, and if the moderators are modelling that and have specific guidelines for what is hate speech, i'm okay with that one type of control. I wonder if this post will be allowed
You are posting in a privately owned forum. You are not standing on a corner preaching, so free speech does NOT come into play here. If you want to discuss all of the stuff you are complaining about, there are lots of forums out there that you can do this on. This is not one of them. All forums have rules of some sort. There are forums that allow almost anything. I think you are looking for the one of those.

BTW, this thread is not a sounding board for everything that makes you mad in society. Your post sounded like you wanted to rant about everything bothering you right now.
 

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Premium Member
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42,901 Posts
You are posting in a privately owned forum. You are not standing on a corner preaching, so free speech does NOT come into play here.
When previous owner EhMax sold the site to VerticalScope it came with this promise—emphasis his.

I know that Verticalscope is absolutely stoked, anxious and eager to make this site whatever the community wants. If that is completely leaving the site as is, than that's what it will be. If it's a few minor tweaks to improve functionality (Such as the image resize, and fixing the "upload button" placement issue) that's what it is.
 

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Premium Member
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6,104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
You are posting in a privately owned forum. You are not standing on a corner preaching, so free speech does NOT come into play here. If you want to discuss all of the stuff you are complaining about, there are lots of forums out there that you can do this on. This is not one of them. All forums have rules of some sort. There are forums that allow almost anything. I think you are looking for the one of those.

BTW, this thread is not a sounding board for everything that makes you mad in society. Your post sounded like you wanted to rant about everything bothering you right now.
Good point. I mean, it is called ehMAC.ca after all. Everything else really shouldn’t be the main event.
 

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Citizen
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4,536 Posts
Hello All :)

A few years ago I got very tired of the negative nature of the discussions here and left. I really have not looked here for years. I also got tired of the series of Macbook headaches and poor performance, and have been on Windows these years, except for my iPhones and old iPad. Interested in my next laptops possibly being Apple products again, I got one of my hunches to take a peek at this old stomping ground recently.

Something had to be done. I understand the owner not wanting the place to be tainted with the outrageous years long flame wars. If I bought this place it would have been the first thing I would have wanted ended. Perhaps others will come back. One day at a time.

May sanity and positivity prevail!
 
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