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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone taken the plunge yet? I actually setup a VMWare virtual machine last night and installed Lion into it (not yet supported, requires some hoop jumping but seems to run fine) ... but when I tried to purchase Lion Server from it ... it told me that it wasn't able to install. Not sure if it's missing requirements or if I need to fiddle more with my VM (I'm going to move it to another machine today that has much more ram available and see what happens).
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yep looks like we're stuck until they sort things out. I was also wondering if it wasn't the way it identifies the CPU (the App Store that is) as in VMWare the CPU's come up as unknown and the Server app requires specific processor types.

I don't have a spare machine to install onto right now to test with so I guess I'm going to either have to spare up a machine to test or wait :/
 
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Discussion Starter #5
FWIW, I'm staying away from Lion Server.

When my mini gets upgraded, it'll be to a CentOS or Debian server.
I run a CentOS server here too, but I actually use a lot of the OSX Server stuff (iCal server, Open Directory, VPN, Netboot, AFP, SMB). Some (probably most actually) can be done in Linux but tend towards being a lot of work to maintain and/or fix, not packaged up so nicely with one button to turn them on like OSX server has. Depends what you need to do I guess, but either way I'll have to support it as well so not much choice but to learn it .. and what better way than running it ;)
 

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Currently have a test copy running at work and my home computer for giggles - and it's a big change from Snow Leopard Server in terms of management tools. There's lot of good changes under the hood and some a lot of people won't like.

Things worth mentioning:

- Profile Manager (MDM Server) is really neat. Worked great at work but at home I had all kinds of certificate issues.
- Push notifications. For mail, iCal and Address Book. I'm looking forward to the day I can upgrade work's server so it supports this. It's AWESOME.
- The new Server app - it grows on you. It's Server Preferences updated to suck a lot less. It's no Server Admin however.
- Server Admin is just a shell of it's former self.
- MySQL isn't installed by default. I never used the default install anyway.
- Server.app's configuration for Web is laughably simple. If you're wanting to configure web sites you're going to the command line.
- Several services are not GUI configurable anymore (eg. FTP which is turned off, NFS)
- No more QuickTime Streaming Server.
- The amount of know how and ease to make a new server that just does file sharing, calendars and an MDM server for small businesses? It takes 15 minutes and it walks you right through it.

I highly recommend checking out AFP548's videos on Lion Server. The one showing off Server.app shows it actually has most of the day to day things you'll actually care about.
 
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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks Chealion. I watched their videos yesterday. I also figured out a way to get it installed here at home as well, will be doing that over the weekend.

I've never (seriously) used the MySQL of web portions of OSX server and when I did try to it wasn't with the built-in stuff because it was too limiting, missing important things, etc.
 

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I bought the new Mac Mini Lion Server yesterday for my home office. Ran the initial setup and seemed pretty easy and intuitive, will have more time to dive deeper in a few weeks. This is my first attempt in running a Mac server since the ASIP days!
 

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How is Lion server at hosting multiple domains, eg newsroom.com/newsroom.net/kevinomura.com etc.

Basically only need web services and maybe email through multiple domains
at the same static IP address. I am just messing up my new SL server and
have the option of upgrading to Lion and Lion Server through the Lion up to date program. Already qualified and have my codes to purchase but am struggling here.
 

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If you do it you are in for a world of hurt. Don't, just don't. Snow Leopard is more suited to what you are doing.
Tell me about it...I've been asked to write a couple chapters of the official Apple Authorized Training Series workbook for use in the LION201 (Server) training courses, and it's an awful pain trying to come up with exercises which all basically tell the student to "Slide the switch to On - the service is now configured."

The server engineers I've been in contact with have told me that if a feature isn't in Server.app, configure it in the command line. Server Admin is quickly becoming deprecated.
 

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How is Lion server at hosting multiple domains, eg newsroom.com/newsroom.net/kevinomura.com etc.

Basically only need web services and maybe email through multiple domains
at the same static IP address. I am just messing up my new SL server and
have the option of upgrading to Lion and Lion Server through the Lion up to date program. Already qualified and have my codes to purchase but am struggling here.
From my gander, it's just as good (if not better because of push notifications) as Snow Leopard. In terms of doing the actual hosting bit.

As for configuration? Well that's your 99 steps backwards. Instead of a somewhat usable GUI to at least get you to a starting point it's entirely by hand now making the reasons to use Mac OS X over installing Linux or Snow Leopard Server very few.
 
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Discussion Starter #14
As for configuration? Well that's your 99 steps backwards. Instead of a somewhat usable GUI to at least get you to a starting point it's entirely by hand now making the reasons to use Mac OS X over installing Linux or Snow Leopard Server very few.
Indeed. Apache/PHP/MySQL stuff has never been great on OSX server to start with and Lion did not help things. If iCalDAV and AFP weren't such a pain in Linux (not to mention time machine backups over the network not being supported, etc) I'd go fully back to Linux in a second for my needs.
 

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Indeed. Apache/PHP/MySQL stuff has never been great on OSX server to start with and Lion did not help things. If iCalDAV and AFP weren't such a pain in Linux (not to mention time machine backups over the network not being supported, etc) I'd go fully back to Linux in a second for my needs.
I haven't had a chance to investigate that closely but with CalendarServer and AddressBookServer both moving to using Postgre as their storage backend - wouldn't that make setting it up on Linux easier? The whole setting up an OD wannabe kludge with CalendarServer 1.0 put me off ever trying to set it up.

Another thing on my list is to see how hard it would be to roll your own APNS (Push Notifications) integration with Dovecot on Linux...
 
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Discussion Starter #16
I haven't had a chance to investigate that closely but with CalendarServer and AddressBookServer both moving to using Postgre as their storage backend - wouldn't that make setting it up on Linux easier? The whole setting up an OD wannabe kludge with CalendarServer 1.0 put me off ever trying to set it up.

Another thing on my list is to see how hard it would be to roll your own APNS (Push Notifications) integration with Dovecot on Linux...
The painful part about the setup was all the fiddly configuration, not so much the backend of things. I haven't tried things lately, I want to find the time to do so as well though. I'm not sure if the db backend as opposed to the flat file setup is going to make that much of a difference.

I'm not sure about Push stuff on linux at all either. I just stared for a couple minutes at the one really nice Linux server I built that's sitting in my rack here at home and collecting dust. It was originally running iSCSI based storage but I've since moved my storage solution to hardware RAID on my OSX Server box and the Linux machine hasn't even been booted in about a year ... I should get cracking on that one!
 

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Ontario
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I have Lion Server installed and it works great. Right now running on a MacMini, no issues at all. I'm looking at it on a large scale for work. Looking at MacPro Server and Promise VTrack attached RAID. This is mainly going to be used a File Server where large files are going to be archived. Haven't made final decision as of yet but I am leaning that way.

BGPS
 
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Discussion Starter #18
Well I got to spend some quality time with Lion server yesterday and all I have to say is wow ... it's got some serious issues going on. Anyone considering deploying this on a large scale I would recommend to wait a while at the very least.

The web interface for the profile management is horrible (and doesn't even render properly in latest Safari!!?!). There are items far down the left hand list that I could not even get to. Push doesn't properly work (at least at first try) for the profiles, and in fact I also had issues even downloading and manually loading a profile on a test machine -- so not sure if it's the push or the actual profile stuff to blame. Some things took, some didn't. Open Directory/network authentication is painfully slow (and yes everything resolves properly both ways). Any changes to configurations result in 2-3 minutes of the "profile manager" updating after you've made the changes, during which time the server was not very responsive (a late 2010 mac mini w/ 4G ram) and nothing else running on it at all. Showed lots of free ram, but it showed the CPU cores massively pegged the whole time.

I am very very disappointed with the direction they have taken things with Lion server. Don't know who they had on the teams that made the decisions on this one but I hope they don't stick around too long :/

I honestly can't recommend this to any clients who need more than absolute basics (file sharing seems to work ok for AFP users anyway). I found serious issues (read: data loss) with iCal and Addressbook components within first 15 minutes of usage. iCal also lost delegation info 3 times in a row on one calendar. Not sure I even fully understand how this new delegation is supposed to work ... when you make new "calendars" they look more like groups (with calendars embedded within them). Group calendars seem to be missing in action as well. Maybe I just need to spend more time with the documentation ...

Time to brush up on my Linux skills again methinks. This new server releases feels very "beta" ... maybe even approaching "alpha" quality.
 
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Discussion Starter #20
And some more fun ... apparently I have a user called "Loading..." AND it lets me edit this user and supposedly the "push" to it works as well (other user names blanked out in the screen shot to protect the innocent hehe).

I take it back on my beta comments, we're definitely dealing with "alpha" material here ...
 

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