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Old Dec 3rd, 2016, 09:26 AM   #61
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irony of having the final resting place of the beast - just steps from the US army base..
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Old Dec 3rd, 2016, 10:55 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macintosh doctor View Post
irony of having the final resting place of the beast - just steps from the US army base..
That would be the illegally-occupied military base, upon which the U.S. illegally held and tortured innocent victims in its global war on terror.

Not much irony, considering that Santiago de Cuba is still sovereign Cuban territory and the eastern provinces typically are the areas where support for the Revolution historically has been the most dedicated.
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Old Dec 3rd, 2016, 11:06 AM   #63
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I wouldn't call that illegally occupied, simply because the Cuban government wont cash the rent cheques.

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That would be the illegally-occupied military base, upon which the U.S. illegally held and tortured innocent victims in its global war on terror.

Not much irony, considering that Santiago de Cuba is still sovereign Cuban territory and the eastern provinces typically are the areas where support for the Revolution historically has been the most dedicated.
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Old Dec 3rd, 2016, 11:09 AM   #64
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That would be the illegally-occupied military base, upon which the U.S. illegally held and tortured innocent victims in its global war on terror.

Not much irony, considering that Santiago de Cuba is still sovereign Cuban territory and the eastern provinces typically are the areas where support for the Revolution historically has been the most dedicated.
you lost me at "US signed a lease "
In 1903, the United States and Cuba signed a lease granting the United States permission to use the land as a coaling and naval station. The lease satisfied the Platt Amendment; this amendment stated a naval base at "certain specific points agreed upon by the President of the United States" was needed to "enable the United States to maintain independence of Cuba." The United States and Cuba signed a treaty in 1934, granting the United States a perpetual lease.[5] Private enterprise is not allowed under the treaty.

Please tell me how it is illegal ?
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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 02:10 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by macintosh doctor View Post
you lost me at "US signed a lease "
....
Please tell me how it is illegal ?
You could, you know, open a book sometime....

One of the better, impeccably-sourced and pragmatic accounts of the major developments of Cuba's history prior to and throughout the Revolution is Jane Franklin's "Cuba and the United States: A Chronological History" (order here). (I received the 2016 updated version just a couple of months ago)
Excerpts:
April 25, 1898: The U.S. Congress formally declares war [against Spain], saying that the state of war between the United States and Spain began April 21. In the United States, this is known as the Spanish-American War. In Cuba, it is known as the U.S. intervention in Cuba's War of Independence.

August 12, 1898: Spain and the United States sign a bilateral armistice. Cuba is not represented at the negotiations.

1901 To codify control of Cuba, the U.S. Congress on March 2 adds the Platt Amendment to an Army Appropriations bill. The amendment provides that Cuba has only a limited right to conduct its own foreign policy and debt policy; the United States may intervene militarily at any time....Since the U.S. Government makes it clear that its military occupation will not end until this amendment becomes part of Cuban law, Cuba incorporates the Platt Amendment into its 1901 Constitution.
Anyone interested in some truly insightful analysis of the Revolution and U.S.-Cuba relations should check out the many other essays available on her website.

One perspective of the constitutional and political legalities of the post-war "independence" "granted" to Cuba can be found in Joseph C. Sweeney's "Guantanamo and U.S. Law" (Fordham International Law Journal, V.30, No.3, 2006. Pp. 681–3):
In the Constitution of February 21, 1901, the delegates adopted a U.S.- type of government for their non-federal or unitary nation with a two-house Congress and a popularly elected president.

Before the Constitution became effective, the United States forced a virtual recognition of a U.S. protectorate over Cuba when Wood told the delegates that the U.S. army would remain until a permanent relation with the U.S. was fixed. Senator Orville H. Platt (R. Conn.) had attached an amendment to the crucial appropriation for the U.S. Army in May 1901 with the following stipulations: (1) Cuba may not become party to a treaty impairing its sovereignty in favor of another State; (2) Cuba may not commit itself to an "excessive foreign debt" beyond its capacity to repay based on ordinary revenue receipts; (3) the United States will maintain Cuban independence and may intervene at any time to preserve life and property, and (4) Cuba will sell or lease territories for coaling stations for the U.S. Navy. Secretary of War, Elihu Root was undoubtedly involved in drafting Platt's Amendment, which was unopposed by the McKinley Administration.

The February Cuban Constitution was amended on June 12, 1901 to incorporate the Platt Amendment into the Constitution. To guarantee the undisturbed future of the Platt Amendment, it was also incorporated into the Treaty of May 22, 1903 between the United States and Cuba.'
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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 02:18 PM   #66
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Since the US could have remained in Cuba or taken it over, what's wrong with the agreement?
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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 02:35 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CubaMark View Post
Excerpts:
April 25, 1898: The U.S. Congress formally declares war [against Spain], saying that the state of war between the United States and Spain began April 21. In the United States, this is known as the Spanish-American War. In Cuba, it is known as the U.S. intervention in Cuba's War of Independence.

August 12, 1898: Spain and the United States sign a bilateral armistice. Cuba is not represented at the negotiations.

1901 To codify control of Cuba, the U.S. Congress on March 2 adds the Platt Amendment to an Army Appropriations bill. The amendment provides that Cuba has only a limited right to conduct its own foreign policy and debt policy; the United States may intervene militarily at any time....Since the U.S. Government makes it clear that its military occupation will not end until this amendment becomes part of Cuban law, Cuba incorporates the Platt Amendment into its 1901 Constitution.
Anyone interested in some truly insightful analysis of the Revolution and U.S.-Cuba relations should check out the many other essays available on her website.

One perspective of the constitutional and political legalities of the post-war "independence" "granted" to Cuba can be found in Joseph C. Sweeney's "Guantanamo and U.S. Law" (Fordham International Law Journal, V.30, No.3, 2006. Pp. 681–3):
[INDENT][I]In the Constitution of February 21, 1901, the delegates adopted a U.S.- type of government for their non-federal or unitary nation with a two-house Congress and a popularly elected president.
]
at any time Cuba could of protested or declared war against spain or us - but decided not to - in its absences - the spoils went to the victors lol
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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 02:50 PM   #68
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I forgot that I was talking to people who would be just pleased as punch if the USA decided to take on another northern state.

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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 02:58 PM   #69
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This stuff is all grandfathered. I don't suggest giving Texas to Mexico, or ceding Nova Scotia to the Mi'kmaq either.The US could have annexed Cuba, but gave them a better deal.

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I forgot that I was talking to people who would be just pleased as punch if the USA decided to take on another northern state.
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Old Dec 4th, 2016, 03:28 PM   #70
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I forgot that I was talking to people who would be just pleased as punch if the USA decided to take on another northern state.

now that you mentioned it - yes i would - any thing to rid ourselves of the decease that Wynne and Trudeau are lol
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