: List of Issues updating to MacOS 10.11.x (El Capitan)


krs
Jul 23rd, 2016, 12:10 PM
I just updated the first Mac in our family to El Capitan and thought it would be useful to create a list of the update issues I (and others) encountered.
That would make it easier to troubleshoot and correct any problems that occurred during the upgarde.
I would encourage anyone who has run into upgrade issues going to El Capitan to post them here.
I'll start with one of my own:

1. Problem is getting to websites in general. Browser has difficulty resolving the URL.
Turns out that when upgrading from 10.9 to 10.11 (which was the upgrade on this specific Mac), the DNS server addresses were not transferred.
Only a single DNS server showed up in Network preferences and it was the ISP DNS server as far as I can tell.
I used to have two ISP DNS servers and the two google DNS servers in Network preferences.
Adding the google servers 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 solved that issue.
As a side note - I'm not crazy about using google for anything because of their tracking.
Anyone have experience with other DNS servers, like the ones from "Level 3"?

209.244.0.3
209.244.0.4
4.2.2.1
4.2.2.2
4.2.2.3
4.2.2.4

2. Apple software will no longer ask if any changes are to be saved but will automatically save the changes and discard the original.
A "work-around" is the check off "Ask to keep changes when closing documents" in System Preferences. This at least provides the option to revert to the original.
Note however that this System Preference option does not work in Apple Mail!

3. The "File>Save As..." option in Snow Leopard (OS 10.6.x) and earlier has disappeared. Rather mind-boggling because it's an option I use many, many times each day - what the heck was Apple thinking???
Apple brought it back, sort of, by selecting "File>Duplicate" and holding down the Option key. This will change "Duplicate" to "Save As...."

John Clay
Jul 23rd, 2016, 03:32 PM
Problem #1 isn't an OS X issue, it's an ISP/router issue. Your ISP will only have one or two DNS servers, and they'll usually suck. They're distributed through DHCP, unless you've set them to be manually entered.

I usually use Google's DNS, or OpenDNS. Level 3 has too much latency, IMO.

https://www.opendns.com

krs
Jul 23rd, 2016, 03:40 PM
Problem #1 isn't an OS X issue, it's an ISP/router issue.

I don't understand why you would say that.
I had the two google DNS server IP addresses manually entered on OS 10.9, I would have expected that the installation of 10.11 on that Mac would carry those over the same way all my other network settings, POP email settings etc. were carried over from 10.9 to 10.11

macintosh doctor
Jul 23rd, 2016, 05:24 PM
Problem #1 isn't an OS X issue, it's an ISP/router issue. Your ISP will only have one or two DNS servers, and they'll usually suck. They're distributed through DHCP, unless you've set them to be manually entered.

I usually use Google's DNS, or OpenDNS. Level 3 has too much latency, IMO.

https://www.opendns.com

have you tried Ultra DNS - they seem pretty good.
No Cost Recursive DNS - also known as DNS Advantage:

increase the performance and resilience of your website
improve the availability of website routing information
secure your dns from hackers
query with confidence
Use nameservers:
156.154.70.1 and 156.154.71.1

gwillikers
Jul 23rd, 2016, 08:30 PM
Take 5 minutes and run NameBench to find the best DNS servers for you. When I ran it I found that my ISP (Shaw) was the fastest.

https://code.google.com/archive/p/namebench

krs
Jul 23rd, 2016, 09:52 PM
I have to change the security settings on 10.11.5 to allow NameBench to run.
I assume there is no hidden malware in this application.

On a related note to the original intent of this thread - I have 248 applications on this Mac that I upgraded to El Capitan and there was only one application - Windows Media Player - which was highlighted as incompatible with this OS.
I find that pretty amazing!
Maybe I have to upgrade some of the other applications but so far I have essentially no issues so list I expected in my first post of this thread is going to be pretty short.
Still miffed that Apple didn't bring back "Save As........." by now, I use that all the time and the only applications that don't have it as a 'direct' option seem to be the Apple ones.

hexdiy
Jul 24th, 2016, 12:55 AM
:-) Windows Media Player, who on earth wants it? Not OSX compatible anyhow.

Nothing wrong with NameBench, BTW.
Just switch your Gatekeeper to "Appstore and trusted developers", and temporarily turn off SIP (System Integrity Protection).

Your 248 longlist of El Cap compatible apps is actually pretty amazing!

krs
Aug 8th, 2016, 01:35 PM
Just came across another snag on El Capitan:

In system preferences I selected "Ask to keep changes when closing documents"
That is to prevent changes to documents to be applied automatically when closing.
I don't really understand why Apple changed the "normal" operation on their application....every 'non-Apple' application I have on El Capitan will automatically ask if I want to save changes and offer an option to save the changes with a different file name.
It has been like that since I started with the Mac way back on Mac OS release 6.

Not sure when Apple decided to make that change, OS 10.6.8 still works the "normal" way.

Anyway - I just found out to my surprise that this "Ask to keep changes...." doesn't work in Apple Mail. If one makes a change and closes mail the change is just saved with no way to revert back to the pre-change message - Edit undo doesn't work either.

I'm going to update my first post and also add the other possible gotchas if one comes from Snow Leopard

pm-r
Aug 8th, 2016, 05:08 PM
I don't use El Cap'n much but the option to keep things like SL was still seems to be there:
Make Sure Your Mac Asks If You Want To Save Changes To Your Documents [OS X Tips] | Cult of Mac (http://www.cultofmac.com/198017/make-sure-your-mac-asks-if-you-want-to-save-changes-to-your-documents-os-x-tips/)

and still is according to Apple:
https://support.apple.com/kb/PH21910?locale=en_US&viewlocale=en_US

I guess I'm not really understanding your problem properly. Or is it just with Mail.app???

PS: It does seem to me that "consistency" is not one of the latest better consistent Apple OS attributes.

krs
Aug 8th, 2016, 06:48 PM
Yes, right now it's just Apple mail where this does not work.

I have had "Ask to keep changes when closing documents" checked off for a while now.

Works in a fashion with the other Apple applications I use but to my surprise I just found out it does not work in Apple Mail.
I say it "works in a fashion" because it doesn't work nearly as nicely and smoothly as in SL.

I think Apple screwed things up when they got rid of "Save As...." and instead of bringing it back the way it was in SL they make you now go via the option key.
That also affects the way changes are saved.

I used to tell everyone that one can't lose any information unless the Mac crashes or one specifically deletes it and then empties the trash.
That should have been an overriding principle in the software design but the Mac OS no longer works this way.

And as you mentioned, the Apple software now also lacks consistency even between Apple applications. That used to be a strong point compared to Windows, but not any more.
Seems there is nobody at Apple steering the ship in a single direction.

AquaAngel
Aug 14th, 2016, 09:16 PM
just reformatted my hard drive and put OSx 10.10.x. i had a lot of issues with 10.11. my brother came over and wanted to have some video to be burn on DVD. El capitain couldn't burn any DVD. SYStem preference crashed, web link issues with safari, issues on rebooting and issues on saving my settings.

So i said ADIOS Capitain and back to 10.10. Also using 10.8, that was the only way i was able to burn my brother's DVD. Email are working super fine. So looks to me that 10.11 needs a lot of work before i can switch to that OS. 10.10 is the only OS i use for my Adobe CS5, fcpX and the latest of microsoft word.

SINC
Aug 14th, 2016, 09:59 PM
Odd, no issues whatsoever.

krs
Aug 15th, 2016, 12:06 AM
Odd, no issues whatsoever.

SINC,

Are you saying you don't have any of the issues that I started to list in post #1?
Or are you just not using the features/operation where the issues are reported?

Another issue I just ran into is with Preview and annotation.
On 10. and I think also in 10.8, when one used preview>tools>annotate>text, one would initially click on an area in the image where one wanted the text to appear and then the text appeared in that area of the image.
For me it was usually bottom right for a © reference.

I tried that same method with El Capitan and intially it looked as if annotate>tet did not work at all!
I fiddled around for quite a while trying to figure out how else I could annotate the images and wasted quite bit of time ungtil I finally, by chance, tried it again on an image that was very light in colour.
Turns out that in 10.11 and maybe earlier, the option to select the image area where one wants the annotation to appear no longer works.
The annotated "text' is automatically positioned right in the middle of the image and if the image colour at that point is the same or close to the text colour, one doesn't see the text - especially if one selected the text it to show up somewhere else.
I don't understand why Apple would make a change like that from the previous OSs - another 'if it ain't broke don't fix it.
Now that I know this it's no longer a real issue although it again requires more unnecessary steps to ge to what we had before - to say nothing of the time I wasted trying to find some alternate method to annotate images.

krs
Aug 15th, 2016, 12:16 AM
Another issue while I think of it.

I have set up a folder on my desktop where all the downloads from the net or email attachments etc. go.
That way I can find them easily.

On previous versions of the OS, at least to OS 10.8, that always worked perfectly.
With El Capitan, that target folder often changes by itself for no apparent reason, to the Apple pre-assigned "Download" folder.
Sometimes the first four downloads go to "my assigned" folder, the rest go to the download folder, or it could happen after one download or not at all after 20 downloads - no rhyme or reason.
Another example where I wasted time - first thinking the download failed for hatever reason, so I downloaded again and again, and finally figuring out what was happening.
I would say that is definitely a bug.

pm-r
Aug 15th, 2016, 01:03 AM
I would say that is definitely a bug.


Bug or not, if this has been happening for a while, I'd sure do some searching for duplicates at least with Find Any File.app or one of the "find duplicate files" apps.
Thomas Tempelmann - Find Any File (http://apps.tempel.org/FindAnyFile/)

Personally and for my older Mac needs, I have not been impressed with any OS X 10.11.x "new and improved" "features", nor do I need any that actually run and are Apple supported on my mid- 2011 iMac or iDevices (definitely not the latest!!!), and 10.9.5 seems to be the best but not perfect version for my use.

CubaMark
Aug 15th, 2016, 01:24 AM
I can't remember a version of OS X in which this wasn't a problem: Emptying the G******N Trash....

https://www.dropbox.com/s/w7q1sesr3sr71es/Stupid%20OS%20X%20Trash.png?raw=1

Am I the only person to whom this happens, or has everyone just accepted it as one of OS X's endearing little quirks?

TiltAgain
Aug 15th, 2016, 06:16 AM
CM, this used to happen to me on a regular basis, but it hasn't happened for the last few updates.

And when this did happen, all I had to do was logout and log back in, and then empty the trash.

Cheers

rgray
Aug 15th, 2016, 06:58 AM
Odd, no issues whatsoever.

Same here!!! ;)

SINC
Aug 15th, 2016, 09:48 AM
SINC,

Are you saying you don't have any of the issues that I started to list in post #1?
Or are you just not using the features/operation where the issues are reported?

Another issue I just ran into is with Preview and annotation.
On 10. and I think also in 10.8, when one used preview>tools>annotate>text, one would initially click on an area in the image where one wanted the text to appear and then the text appeared in that area of the image.
For me it was usually bottom right for a © reference.

I tried that same method with El Capitan and intially it looked as if annotate>tet did not work at all!
I fiddled around for quite a while trying to figure out how else I could annotate the images and wasted quite bit of time ungtil I finally, by chance, tried it again on an image that was very light in colour.
Turns out that in 10.11 and maybe earlier, the option to select the image area where one wants the annotation to appear no longer works.
The annotated "text' is automatically positioned right in the middle of the image and if the image colour at that point is the same or close to the text colour, one doesn't see the text - especially if one selected the text it to show up somewhere else.
I don't understand why Apple would make a change like that from the previous OSs - another 'if it ain't broke don't fix it.
Now that I know this it's no longer a real issue although it again requires more unnecessary steps to ge to what we had before - to say nothing of the time I wasted trying to find some alternate method to annotate images.

My system does the same with annotation and has been different since El Cap was introduced so I was used to it and did not consider it anything but a change in the way it works and am used to it. That noted, it is another poorly thought out move by Apple IMHO.

SINC
Aug 15th, 2016, 09:53 AM
I can't remember a version of OS X in which this wasn't a problem: Emptying the G******N Trash....

https://www.dropbox.com/s/w7q1sesr3sr71es/Stupid%20OS%20X%20Trash.png?raw=1

Am I the only person to whom this happens, or has everyone just accepted it as one of OS X's endearing little quirks?

This happened to me a single time and an update fixed it so have not had it as an issue since. I simply used Terminal to secure empty the trash.

sudo rm -rf ~/.Trash/*


Seems to me that like Tilt, it did not last very long.

CubaMark
Aug 15th, 2016, 01:44 PM
Tks guys. I know of the various ways to do it (using the Finder's "Secure empty Trash" worked prior to my upgrade to El Capitan —THANKS APPLE for taking that away from me. Jerks) but in my experience, it's the norm, not the exception. Nor do I want to have to do a logout or reboot just to empty the damn trash!

I also think it's almost exclusively an issue with Mail. I need to remember to try quitting Mail next time before attempting to empty trash when this occurs.

On my next rant, we'll go into the stupid generic "Enter your iCloud password" prompt that repeatedly asks - but never accepts - the password. And only rarely does it indicate which system process is making the request (today I had a FaceTime request - no idea why - and then a generic "Enter your iCloud password" request). Once upon a time I got rid of these with one of those G-D "application specific passwords", but that's not working here, since it doesn't indicate which application is making the request.

Very bad form, Apple. Remember when "it just works" meant something?

pm-r
Aug 15th, 2016, 01:49 PM
I can't remember a version of OS X in which this wasn't a problem: Emptying the G******N Trash....

https://www.dropbox.com/s/w7q1sesr3sr71es/Stupid%20OS%20X%20Trash.png?raw=1

Am I the only person to whom this happens, or has everyone just accepted it as one of OS X's endearing little quirks?


I usually find that there's still an opened .dmg image file somewhere that one has used when this message shows up.

pm-r
Aug 15th, 2016, 01:56 PM
My system does the same with annotation and has been different since El Cap was introduced so I was used to it and did not consider it anything but a change in the way it works and am used to it. That noted, it is another poorly thought out move by Apple IMHO.


And that is one of my main gripes with Apple's "new and improved" OS X versions.

Changes are meant to include improvements and especially when they make logical sense!!!

Kleles
Aug 15th, 2016, 04:38 PM
I usually find that there's still an opened .dmg image file somewhere that one has used when this message shows up.


I’ve never experienced this issue with any update.

krs
Aug 17th, 2016, 03:35 PM
Another thing that drives me nuts and wastes a lot of time in ElCapitan (and earlier OS versions but not Snow Leopard) is that files I download are not added, what I call "dynamically" to the folder I save them to.

In SL, if I downloaded a file into my "Special desktop download" folder, I could open that folder right after the download and the file would be there.
Same if I accessed that folder to add that file to a forum post for instance.

Not so with ElCapitan - when I open the folder after the download, the downloaded file is not there - sometimes it shows up after I open the folder several times, sometimes I have to do a 'find' command first before it shows up in the folder.

If I do a "find" right after the download, the Mac finds it no problem - indicates that the file is in the folder where I expect it (checking the bottom of the open find window) but when I open the folder after that, it's still often not there until later.
Never happened on SL.

CubaMark
Aug 17th, 2016, 03:57 PM
Another thing that drives me nuts and wastes a lot of time in ElCapitan (and earlier OS versions but not Snow Leopard) is that files I download are not added, what I call "dynamically" to the folder I save them to.

I've also experienced this enough times to bug me....

SINC
Aug 17th, 2016, 10:20 PM
Another thing that drives me nuts and wastes a lot of time in ElCapitan (and earlier OS versions but not Snow Leopard) is that files I download are not added, what I call "dynamically" to the folder I save them to.

In SL, if I downloaded a file into my "Special desktop download" folder, I could open that folder right after the download and the file would be there.
Same if I accessed that folder to add that file to a forum post for instance.

Not so with ElCapitan - when I open the folder after the download, the downloaded file is not there - sometimes it shows up after I open the folder several times, sometimes I have to do a 'find' command first before it shows up in the folder.

If I do a "find" right after the download, the Mac finds it no problem - indicates that the file is in the folder where I expect it (checking the bottom of the open find window) but when I open the folder after that, it's still often not there until later.
Never happened on SL.

I have for many years now just set all downloaded files to land on my desktop. I then move the files to a location that suits me. Works for me and soooo simple. ;)

hexdiy
Aug 17th, 2016, 11:11 PM
Go Unix/Terminal Command Line Mark, but beware: backup because this is irreversible/ nuking:

(Terminal)

srm -v /path/to/file/to/securely/delete/example.png

How to Use “Secure Empty Trash” Equivalent in OS X El Capitan | OSXDaily (http://osxdaily.com/2015/10/12/secure-empty-trash-equivalent-mac-os-x/)

rgray
Aug 18th, 2016, 12:07 AM
Go Unix/Terminal Command Line Mark, but beware: backup because this is irreversible/ nuking:

(Terminal)

srm -v /path/to/file/to/securely/delete/example.png

How to Use “Secure Empty Trash” Equivalent in OS X El Capitan | OSXDaily (http://osxdaily.com/2015/10/12/secure-empty-trash-equivalent-mac-os-x/)

Note that this link describes a simple drag and drop method which some may be more comfortable than typing the whole file location sequence.....

Again!! Note warning

Once you hit the return key there is no going back, this is truly irreversible. The deleted files are overwritten 35 times, which exceeds the US Department of Defense standard for securely erasing data by five times. In other words, your file or folder that you secure removed is gone for good.

hexdiy
Aug 18th, 2016, 08:17 PM
+1 rgray, thanks for repeating the warning!

The srm command seems to be as amnesiac as the rm -rf command, and thus not for the faint of heart nor Terminal unexperienced users!

Let me note too, that Secure Empty Trash was removed because of a bug with some SSDs.
Not what I'd call quality bugfixing...

wonderings
Aug 22nd, 2016, 03:48 PM
Another thing that drives me nuts and wastes a lot of time in ElCapitan (and earlier OS versions but not Snow Leopard) is that files I download are not added, what I call "dynamically" to the folder I save them to.

In SL, if I downloaded a file into my "Special desktop download" folder, I could open that folder right after the download and the file would be there.
Same if I accessed that folder to add that file to a forum post for instance.

Not so with ElCapitan - when I open the folder after the download, the downloaded file is not there - sometimes it shows up after I open the folder several times, sometimes I have to do a 'find' command first before it shows up in the folder.

If I do a "find" right after the download, the Mac finds it no problem - indicates that the file is in the folder where I expect it (checking the bottom of the open find window) but when I open the folder after that, it's still often not there until later.
Never happened on SL.

Have never experienced this, if I had this would bug me as well. My downloads go to the default download folder which I have in my dock. Files are instantly there for me to move when they are finished, or not even finished downloading. Hopefully I never have this issue!

krs
Aug 22nd, 2016, 04:56 PM
Wonderings -

I have to test that in more detail but for the downloaded files that did end up in the "Apple assigned" download folder (by El Capitan changing the download folder destination all on its own), I do think they showed up there right away.
It's almost as if Apple hired a bunch of new software programmers who have no clue about the previous Mac OS flexibility.

This problem is getting worse for me - before I could open my assigned download folder a few times and eventually the downloaded file would show up - now it seems I have to find the file first using the Apple find command and actually open the downloaded file before it shows up in my assigned download folder.
BTW - the path to the file shows it's in my download folder on the desktop - it just doesn't show up for quite a while when I open that folder.

Reminds me more and more of the old Windows we used to run at the office - if one didn't access or use files/folders exactly the way Microsoft had envisioned it, there was a good chance things didn't work as expected. The Mac OS always used to work the way I expected it, at least mostly, but that is becoming a thing of the past.

pm-r
Aug 22nd, 2016, 06:33 PM
It's almost as if Apple hired a bunch of new software programmers who have no clue about the previous Mac OS flexibility.


Man, you hit it bang on with that comment and add good consistent user interface guidelines that seem to have flown the coop and have even got worse since Apple put Sir Jony Ive as software head who doesn't seem to have a clue other than make things thinner… but they seem to put him on some sort of pedestal. Strange directions IMHO!!! :(

Kleles
Aug 22nd, 2016, 08:30 PM
I’ve never had this issue with downloaded files in any OS X version. I use the ‘preset’ Downloads folder, and haven’t set up another permanent downloads folder. Once downloaded I then move files to their ultimate destination. There has not been a problem of files being present, then not, the available again.

pm-r
Aug 22nd, 2016, 09:19 PM
I’ve never had this issue with downloaded files in any OS X version.


So far, neither have I, and I have almost always changed the browser default "Downloads" folder to my Desktop folder and then deal with them and they always show as expected.

It seems I also have Google Drive but not used much and was just informed I need to sign in again when I just opened it.

Using OS X Mavericks 10.9.5 mostly.

krs
Aug 27th, 2016, 01:28 PM
Just ran into another issue that may be ElCapitan related.

When I look at the German description on this webpage usinf FF 48.0.1 and Mac OS 10.11.5:
DEV Dampflok (Steam locomotive) "Franzburg" - GartenBahn DatenBank (http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=7102&mode=search&l=deutsch)
there is an incorrect space added after each Umlaut (the letters with two dots over the letter, like ä)

If I look at the same webpage with the same version of FireFox but running Mac OS 10.6.8 there is no space after the Umlaut.

That webpage description was added about 1 1/2 years ago.

If I now look at the same type of webpage but where the description was added only a month ago, ie:
Wismarer Schienenbus (Railbus) T 25 - GartenBahn DatenBank (http://www.gbdb.info/details.php?image_id=7461&l=deutsch)
it renders fine with ElCapitan and FF 48.0.1

Also, when using a different browser, Safari, Chrome or Maxthon with ElCapitan, there is no problem.
Problem only seems to occur with FireFox and ElCapitan and only on older webpages.

Anyoner have a clue what is going on here?

krs
Sep 7th, 2016, 12:22 PM
Another thing that drives me nuts and wastes a lot of time in ElCapitan (and earlier OS versions but not Snow Leopard) is that files I download are not added, what I call "dynamically" to the folder I save them to.

In SL, if I downloaded a file into my "Special desktop download" folder, I could open that folder right after the download and the file would be there.
Same if I accessed that folder to add that file to a forum post for instance.

Not so with ElCapitan - when I open the folder after the download, the downloaded file is not there - sometimes it shows up after I open the folder several times, sometimes I have to do a 'find' command first before it shows up in the folder.

If I do a "find" right after the download, the Mac finds it no problem - indicates that the file is in the folder where I expect it (checking the bottom of the open find window) but when I open the folder after that, it's still often not there until later.
Never happened on SL.

Well, after some experimenting I found the following:

This issue with El Capitan seems to happen because the folder I have set up on the desktop has a large number of files in it.
When I download something and direct the download to another folder which initially had no files in it and now only has three files in it, the downloaded file shows up immediately the way it should (and the way it did with SL)
I didn't hink there was a limit of how many files one can place in a folder - well this is not really a "limit" issue, the file is in the folder it just doesn't show up when opening the folder - at least not until the file is opened at least once.

SINC
Sep 7th, 2016, 12:50 PM
I avoid this issue by directing all downloads to the desktop, then drag to the appropriate folder. It works fine and only takes a second.

krs
Sep 7th, 2016, 05:45 PM
I avoid this issue by directing all downloads to the desktop, then drag to the appropriate folder. It works fine and only takes a second.

I can't do that because my desktop is full of folders that I'm working on and it would take me minutes to find a download, especially since downloads would end up in different areas of the desktop.

I now direct all downloads to the new folder I have created - it's a workaround that works for me fine so far.

But this is still flaw with ElCapitan - a problem that wasn't there with Snow Leopard.

krs
Sep 27th, 2016, 01:07 PM
Here is another El Capitan special.

When resizing a whole batch of photos I used this approach with Preview:

Step 1: Select all the images you want to resize.
Step 2: Right click on them and select “Open With Preview.”
Step 3: In Preview, go to Edit > Select All.
Step 4: Once all images are selected, go to Tools > Adjust Size.

Worked fine with the older software - with El Capitan everything works OK up to including step 4 but then one has to save each picture individually when one wants to close the folder all the pictures are in.

I think this is another remnant of Apple's screw-up removing "Save As..." and then not bringing it back properly.

pm-r
Sep 27th, 2016, 08:43 PM
When resizing a whole batch of photos I used this approach with Preview:

Anything different from this???:
How to quickly resize multiple images at once on Mac (http://www.idownloadblog.com/2013/10/19/how-to-resize-multiple-images-mac/)
or
https://support.apple.com/kb/PH22446?locale=en_US&viewlocale=en_US
or maybe even this:
How does Photos resize images on export or drag? | Macworld (http://www.macworld.com/article/3022572/software/how-does-photos-resize-images-on-export-or-drag.html)

Or google I guess to try and find what might have changed.

PS: Your method still works on my Mavericks 10.9.5 2011 iMac as you say.
So much for "new & improved" "Features with the later OS X versions maybe??? :(


.

hexdiy
Sep 27th, 2016, 09:03 PM
Well, after some experimenting I found the following:

This issue with El Capitan seems to happen because the folder I have set up on the desktop has a large number of files in it.
When I download something and direct the download to another folder which initially had no files in it and now only has three files in it, the downloaded file shows up immediately the way it should (and the way it did with SL)
I didn't hink there was a limit of how many files one can place in a folder - well this is not really a "limit" issue, the file is in the folder it just doesn't show up when opening the folder - at least not until the file is opened at least once.

This may also be a problem of older files being encoded in UTF-8 keyboard input, newer ones in UTF-16 input.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTF-16

pm-r
Sep 27th, 2016, 11:00 PM
I can't do that because my desktop is full of folders that I'm working on and it would take me minutes to find a download, especially since downloads would end up in different areas of the desktop.

I now direct all downloads to the new folder I have created - it's a workaround that works for me fine so far.

But this is still flaw with ElCapitan - a problem that wasn't there with Snow Leopard.


BTW: I also tend to clutter my desktop with "current projects", but eventually clear them off to their later holding place/folders, but I really can't imaging working, at least efficiently, with a desktop that was THAT cluttered.

You may want to re-consider your computer work methods and maybe even create your own "custom Desktop folder" on your Desktop and place all you current stuff in it as it will have many more faster sorting options and access with everything in its own place if you want.

But just saying though … and as a thought and for possibly better work efficiency. :rolleyes:

krs
Oct 3rd, 2016, 12:29 AM
This may also be a problem of older files being encoded in UTF-8 keyboard input, newer ones in UTF-16 input.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UTF-16

Strangely enough the downloads to that "problem" folder are working again - ie they show up right away.
I cleaned up that folder a little bit but I don't know if that's what may have made the difference.
Anyway - right now I have 27115 items in there, so at least I now have a reference - unfortunately didn't check the number when I was having problems.

krs
Oct 3rd, 2016, 12:37 AM
You may want to re-consider your computer work methods and maybe even create your own "custom Desktop folder" on your Desktop and place all you current stuff in it...............:

I tried that once a couple of years ago - didn't work for me.
But thanks for the suggestion.

If it turns out that there is actually a limit to the total number of items I can place in a folder, I will just go back and change all my downloads from email and the various browsers to a new folder (which I had started to do but now the original one works fine again).

rgray
Oct 3rd, 2016, 12:09 PM
Strangely enough the downloads to that "problem" folder are working again - ie they show up right away.
I cleaned up that folder a little bit but I don't know if that's what may have made the difference.
Anyway - right now I have 27115 items in there, so at least I now have a reference - unfortunately didn't check the number when I was having problems.

27115!!???

Gee. I wonder why it could be slow and problematic....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

pm-r
Oct 3rd, 2016, 12:54 PM
27115!!???

Gee. I wonder why it could be slow and problematic....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:



Ahh… I was just about to post with a similar comment, but a refresh page showed this and I'd have to agree.

You may well be within the Mac OS X limits, but not a normal user one and one without lags or problems if the number is accurate and not a misprint.

See:
https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT201711

Yes we know it says you can, but…. aghhhhh don't push it that far!!!

krs
Oct 3rd, 2016, 10:06 PM
27115!!???

Gee. I wonder why it could be slow and problematic....... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

pm-r was kind enough to post this:
Maximum number of files (or files and folders) in a folder (all Mac OS X versions)
up to 2.1 billion (2)

I don't think the number of files in that folder was the issue.
Maybe there was a corrupt file in there causing problems.

Anyway - I was surprised myself at the number - it's the number that shows at the bottom of that folder window - I assume it's correct.
This way I have a reference point if the same thing happens again.

pm-r
Oct 3rd, 2016, 11:08 PM
And I'll also strongly support what rgray posted regardless what Apple says, especially in the world of reality which they don't seem to be in sometimes lately.

25+ thousand items in a single normal Finder folder is just too many for any Mac to handle properly. I don't give a sh*t what Apple says is the limit. It's NOT a NORMAL WORKING amount to attempt to use. Period!!! AMEN!………:D

If you feel otherwise, by all means carry on doing things your way. Your choice!! :rolleyes: