Are you a property manager or a property owner who rents out their properties, i.e. a landlord?
Depends on the property.
But in some cases, yes, I'm both owner and property manager.
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As you indicate in some situations of course you can be/are both.
If you are a property manager you work for the property owner if you are a landlord you do work in essence for the tenants as you have certain basic obligations that you must fulfill to the tenants. No tenants no income, so you are in fact being paid by someone else for the commodity you provide so I can't agree with your semantics.
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Are you a property manager or a property owner who rents out their properties, i.e. a landlord?
If you are a property manager you work for the property owner if you are a landlord you do work in essence for the tenants (in some situations of course you can be/are both) as you have certain basic obligations that you must fulfill to the tenants. No tenants no income so you are in fact being paid by someone else for the commodity you provide so I can't agree with your semantics.
Well, I don't quite agree with your semantics either.
I have obligations to the maintaining value of the asset. The tenants are a part of that asset. If the asset becomes more valuable by having no tenants (i.e., the property has value as a land-development package) then to hell with the tenants because their presence devalues my asset.
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Are you a property manager or a property owner who rents out their properties, i.e. a landlord?
If you are a property manager you work for the property owner if you are a landlord you do work in essence for the tenants (in some situations of course you can be/are both) as you have certain basic obligations that you must fulfill to the tenants. No tenants no income so you are in fact being paid by someone else for the commodity you provide so I can't agree with your semantics.
Not true. Owning property and making money from selling/renting a product you own doesn't mean you "work for them", just because you have an obligation to ensure the product or service being paid for continues to be what is agreed upon.
Even if you were a property manager, as a freelance business who takes care of 1 or many properties, if it's a business and that's the service, you still, don't work for the tenants.
My quip to macfury was just saying it often doesn't feel as though I work for myself, as I often have many of the same obligations, deadlines, being at work, etc etc as someone who works -for- someone.
He's right though, working for yourself has many benefits and advantages you don't have being a 9-5er.
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Not true. Owning property and making money from selling/renting a product you own doesn't mean you "work for them", just because you have an obligation to ensure the product or service being paid for continues to be what is agreed upon.
Even if you were a property manager, as a freelance business who takes care of 1 or many properties, if it's a business and that's the service, you still, don't work for the tenants.
Then of course, there are the owners/investors who hire out a property management company--which describes the majority of landlords. They really aren't working for anyone except possibly themselves, and in a lot of cases most of that is delegated to the property manager.... people are working for them, and they collect money.
It's a funny kind of a business.
I've work for employers, and I've worked clients--this is definitely quite different.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonal
Well, I don't quite agree with your semantics either.
I have obligations to the maintaining value of the asset. The tenants are a part of that asset. If the asset becomes more valuable by having no tenants (i.e., the property has value as a land-development package) then to hell with the tenants because their presence devalues my asset.
Quote:
Originally Posted by groovetube
Not true. Owning property and making money from selling/renting a product you own doesn't mean you "work for them", just because you have an obligation to ensure the product or service being paid for continues to be what is agreed upon.
Even if you were a property manager, as a freelance business who takes care of 1 or many properties, if it's a business and that's the service, you still, don't work for the tenants.
My quip to macfury was just saying it often doesn't feel as though I work for myself, as I often have many of the same obligations, deadlines, being at work, etc etc as someone who works -for- someone.
He's right though, working for yourself has many benefits and advantages you don't have being a 9-5er.
PART III - RESPONSIBILITIES OF LANDLORDS
20. Landlord's responsibility to repair 21. Landlord's responsibility re services
22. Landlord not to interfere with reasonable enjoyment 23. Landlord not to harass, etc.
24. Changing locks 25. Privacy
26. Entry without notice 27. Entry with notice
28. Entry by canvassers 29. Tenant applications
30. Order, repair, comply with standards 31. Other orders re s. 29
32. Eviction with termination order
Being that you have such obligations as to the minimum conditions/provisions that you supply your tenants you are at their service, no matter how minimally.
The tenants are not part of the asset as you do not in any way own the tenants. They may affect the value of the asset but they are not part of the asset.
Without tenants and selling the property purely as an asset it would fit into the exceptions I mentioned previously regarding selling equities and commodities, albeit of a different order, as you would be selling it to an individual and not traded on an exchange where there is no single individual buying your asset.
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Last edited by screature; Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:45 PM.
I see the tenants as individual clients who come and go. The landlord/owner of such a building would be self-employed, with a range of clients who pay for the management service provided. The landlord/owner works all costs into this management fee and calls it rent.
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Location: Aylmer (Gatineau) across the river from Ottawa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonal
Then of course, there are the owners/investors who hire out a property management company--which describes the majority of landlords. They really aren't working for anyone except possibly themselves, and in a lot of cases most of that is delegated to the property manager.... people are working for them, and they collect money.
It's a funny kind of a business.
I've work for employers, and I've worked clients--this is definitely quite different.
And therein lies the difference between being employed and being self-employed... either way someone else is paying you and why gt's point is moot and irrelevant to the definition of what constitutes being self-employed.
You are definitely self-employed (as far as tax law is concerned), but as a landlord and/or property manager and landlord you definitely do not fit into the categories I previously mentioned (selling equities and commodities without other form of income or independently wealthy) as long as you have tenants in your properties to whom you are beholden for your income...
At any rate this is all for another thread as this is a full on derailment of this one.
Who else has been/is going on vacation...?
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Last edited by screature; Feb 17th, 2012 at 02:08 PM.
Hmmm. Seems I've lost track of what is being, argued about.
I guess I'm not self employed since I'm providing ongoing products and services and have an obligation to work on these.
Or, I am. Hmmm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjimmy
Is that a rainbow I see...?
I think i-rui in another thread mentioned that a stopped clock tends to be right at least once a day
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