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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 03:24 PM   #2361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfury View Post
The transformation is not necessary. It only appears to be so because of the limitations of your own mental constructs.
... right... "there is no spoon" ... if we can just harness the power of the Force or whatever, everything'l be fine.

Quote:
The "real, immutable laws of nature" will allow us to consume ALL of our fossil fuels while we work out a cheaper alternative.
Even if there were any rational basis for this position, it is still inevitable that we must work out alternatives.

As the basis for further discussion, will you at least agree that establishing viable sustainable energy alternatives is desirable?
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 03:27 PM   #2362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanc View Post
... right... "there is no spoon" ... if we can just harness the power of the Force or whatever, everything'l be fine.



Even if there were any rational basis for this position, it is still inevitable that we must work out alternatives.

As the basis for further discussion, will you at least agree that establishing viable sustainable energy alternatives is desirable?
according to 'fury, that's coming along really well(!) already.

Apparently.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 03:43 PM   #2363
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Originally Posted by kps View Post
Oh, so now the regulations are drafted by the wicked corporations...Ok.
CRTC is which broadcast Corporations's BITCH again? The rulings served up by this regulator have nothing to do with the general public's interest in the public airwaves, now do they?

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Originally Posted by kps View Post
How about the really uber-wicked Crown Corporations...like the monopolistic CBC, LCBO, Canada Post, etc. LOL
Seem to have inadvertently left off this Crown Corporation; The Canada Employment Insurance Financing Board, off the list. Think? Think? Think? Why? Why? Why could that be?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBCNews
A federal agency created by the Harper government with great political fanfare in 2008 is costing millions of dollars to achieve pretty much nothing.

The Canada Employment Insurance Financing Board has just about everything a budding government agency could want.

So far, it has spent over $3.3 million for new offices, computers and furniture, well-paid executives and staff, travel budgets, expense accounts, board meetings, and lots of pricey consultants.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBCNews
Alyson Queen, a spokeswoman for Human Resources Minister Diane Finley, says the government has no intention of scrapping "an important stewardship group that oversees the integrity and transparency of EI financing."
Do Nothing but wastes 3.3 Million Dollars

A do nothing, well except for moving to more prestigious diggs, whilst doing nada.
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Last edited by BigDL; Jan 20th, 2012 at 03:55 PM.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 03:46 PM   #2364
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Originally Posted by bryanc View Post
As the basis for further discussion, will you at least agree that establishing viable sustainable energy alternatives is desirable?
Not now.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 04:20 PM   #2365
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you're a little quick on the draw here. The point of my statement was to address your contention that the importance of corporations generating capital first in order to benefit people rather, than the other way round, is backwards.

People don't -need- corporations, it's the other way round. The sooner we come to this realization, the better. Despite many's assertion that opposition like OWS etc. is all about tearing it all down, it isn't. It's about changing it.
Like I have said, time to move on, I don't want to engage further with you on this subject... we simply don't agree and most likely never will. I am cool with that...
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 04:25 PM   #2366
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All living (and many non-living) systems obtain energy without capital. Your average blue whale obtains and consumes vast amounts of energy, and does so without any money at all.

But I recognize that what you're really asking is how can *we* capture, distribute and utilize energy for things like computers, cars, and industry, and that will obviously require technological infrastructure that, because of the way we have organized our society, can only be achieved through economic means. What I hope you recognize is that this limitation (the need for capital) is ultimately a function of human behaviour, and that it therefore is not an immutable fact of nature.

In order to succeed in the necessary transformation our civilization must undergo (because of real, immutable laws of nature), we may have to change things like the way our economy works. Changing the economy is challenging, but not impossible, and it will be easier as more people recognize if for the arbitrary social construct that it is.
Yes I do.

It isn't arbitrary at all as it has evolved over thousands of years of human existence... trade and commerce came into existence because it is a far more humane way of getting what we want and need than invading, raping and pillaging.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 04:29 PM   #2367
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Isn't the whole raping and pillaging thing more about gaining power, rather than what we need?

Not really much different than now if anyone's honest. Just ask haliburton for starters, or many of the massive weapons industry.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 05:08 PM   #2368
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Isn't the whole raping and pillaging thing more about gaining power, rather than what we need?

Not really much different than now if anyone's honest. Just ask haliburton for starters, or many of the massive weapons industry.
Tech is a far bigger sector...

And yes it is much, much different now if anyone is being honest and not hyperbolic.
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 05:16 PM   #2369
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right. Instead of clubs and Swords we have smart bombs now. "police actions".

"operation Iraqi Freedom".
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Old Jan 20th, 2012, 05:24 PM   #2370
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left turn. Er, maybe, straight ahead.

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ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
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