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Old Jan 14th, 2010, 09:05 PM   #61
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Old Jan 14th, 2010, 10:57 PM   #62
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I've encountered far, far too many horrible people who've achieved success and genuine happiness (none of this 'but are they really happy on the inside' B.S., please) to believe in karma.
I agree 100%. They don't give unhappiness the time of day.
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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 01:11 PM   #63
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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 08:19 PM   #64
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God made Man, Man made religion (no capital R for religion)

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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 09:53 PM   #65
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God made Man
Is man God's biggest mistake, or is God man's biggest mistake?

(roughly translated from Nietzsche)

Personally, I think it's the latter.
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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 10:09 PM   #66
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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 10:42 PM   #67
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This thread is hardly the place to start a serious philosophical discussion, but I'll throw this out for your consideration:

There is not now, nor has there ever been, any evidence for any supernatural phenomena of any kind. This fact remains true in the face of our species' fundamental bias towards the belief in supernatural explanations, even in the face of evidence for mundane explanations.

Furthermore, it has now been demonstrated beyond any doubt that many species (including chickens) become superstitious in the context of randomized reinforcement, and that under random reinforcement, superstitious behaviour is at no disadvantage. If a given explanation is at no disadvantage to a complete lack of an explanation, the explanation that does as well as "I have no idea" is going to do better.

It therefore follows logically that our ancestors were highly superstitious and concocted many complex, and completely fictitious myths to explain their world, and there emerged a competitive 'market place' of mythology as communication systems emerged in human societies.

Those mythologies that were able to attract and retain adherents prospered, and those that were less able to do so either changed or disappeared.

As these belief systems were transmitted from believer to convert, and challenged by other beliefs and different contexts, they changed and adapted to their environment.

We now live in a culture were these beliefs have been evolving for literally hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of years, and are ideally optimized to 'feel' right to human minds. This has nothing to do with their congruence with objective reality.

There remains no objective evidence that any of these supernaturally-based superstitions are any more valid than another, or random chance. And there is ample evidence that all of them are fundamentally false.

Of course, as non-falsifiable tenants, none of them can be proved untrue (any that could be have long ago been proved untrue, and all surviving forms are immune to this attack).

But I would hope that as citizens of a 21st century civilization, with at least the basics of scientific literacy and the capacity for critical thought, most, if not all of you should be capable of rationally examining your beliefs and expunging the most egregiously irrational fantasies, which form the basis of all modern religions.

If any of you want to discuss this in a rational manner, please accept my invitation to do so here.
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Old Jan 15th, 2010, 10:46 PM   #68
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Puzzling to me that one can reject religion yet still accept god. Isn't that really just trying to have it both ways? How on earth does a person learn about god except through religion? Seems to me that if you reject religion, you must ultimately also be rejecting the concept of god. It's like saying, "I love mankind—it's people I hate."
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Old Jan 16th, 2010, 12:07 AM   #69
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Puzzling to me that one can reject religion yet still accept god. Isn't that really just trying to have it both ways? How on earth does a person learn about god except through religion? Seems to me that if you reject religion, you must ultimately also be rejecting the concept of god. It's like saying, "I love mankind—it's people I hate."
Good point.
I think what people are really saying in those instances where they bemoan "organized religion" is that they'd like to have the afterlife package they're offering but they're turned off by the terms put down by religion a,b or c to achieve it. I find it funny that you can attend the wake of the wildest guy in town that may have outright rejected the whole god thing yet you'll often hear people say things like "he's at rest now" or "he's in a better place" or "may he rest in peace". I noticed that when George Carlin died and found it quite ironic.

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Old Jan 16th, 2010, 03:17 AM   #70
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Good point.
I think what people are really saying in those instances where they bemoan "organized religion" is that they'd like to have the afterlife package they're offering but they're turned off by the terms put down by religion a,b or c to achieve it. I find it funny that you can attend the wake of the wildest guy in town that may have outright rejected the whole god thing yet you'll often hear people say things like "he's at rest now" or "he's in a better place" or "may he rest in peace". I noticed that when George Carlin died and found it quite ironic.

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Good points, especially with respect to our late friend, Mr. Carlin.

George Carlin On Religion
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