Now that the big scary headlines have faded, it's time to look at the facts of this "plot".
Maybe nxmx can give us the definition of entrapment in the context of a sting operation. We should take the announcement in context of a government keen on manipulating the message to push a controversial agenda.
The facts are that they purchased 3 tonnes of ammonia nitrate. Do you think they were considering a career in farming?
Nice accusation against the Conservatives. Prove it. You do realize the RCMP and the federal government operate separately, right?
Why can't you just admit these terrorists were a real threat?
You are the perfect NeoCon VD.
The message was geared towards you and it's given you some kind of "high".
No amount of reasonable talk will convince you that otherwise. If this is not reminiscent of the fearmongering to the south then you will never "get it".
Yes VD they purchased fertilizer and yes they may have had intent to harm Canadians.
But in your desperation for a boogeyman you are ready to forgo any critical thinking. Reminds me of those idiotic fools in 1984....
If you read Harper's little speech, I'd hope that you would also laugh at the Bush-like key phrases.
The facts of this case is slowly coming out - yet I'm sure that you would have these men up against a firing squad if you could.
There is nothing wrong with bringing up questions about this operation - after all don't you want to know the truth?
These "criminals" had to be extremely stupid buying 3 tonnes of fertilizer and something does not smell right about this story. The accounts vary from they had been planning this for years and only now started to buy the bomb making material?
The press conference with the visual aids looked suspicious - and adding the fake bag of fertilizer only added to the farcical element. Wonder if any other props were fake?
The dialogue from Ottawa is slowly changing and the fear factor has been pumped up.
When it comes to an element of trust, sadly there is one lacking in this government. Yes the people involved may have done a good job but in the context of empty rhetoric.
I'm still waiting for the facts to emerge from these arrests. You have gone into "they want to kill us all" panic mode....
I find some comments from people like MacDoc and AS hilarious. I guess short of strapping them to the bags of ammonium nitrate themselves they won't believe it. Oh wait, this is Harper's secret agenda!
As to the "sting". The fertilizer companies have been in cahoots with the police for a number of years. It would take only one call from a distributor to set the ball rolling. A legitimate order was called and delivery arranged. The shipment was intercepted at source by the police. That's not entrapment. An order went through by persons yet to be named.
AS, I don't see anyone panicking here. I do see some common sense dialogue. Interestingly, none of my Muslim friends were one bit surprised at the news. They've been expecting it. It remains to be seen who of the 17 are proven guilty but the fact remains if not this bunch then others to follow.
BTW, I live only a mile from speculated targets. I'm grateful the police have done their work.
I find some comments from people like MacDoc and AS hilarious. I guess short of strapping them to the bags of ammonium nitrate themselves they won't believe it. Oh wait, this is Harper's secret agenda!
AS, I don't see anyone panicking here. I do see some common sense dialogue.
I doubt they would believe it if something happened. They would probably claim it was a conspiracy.
adagio, please point out where I said that there was no intent?
There is nothing wrong with a little caution before branding them all terrorists...
Given the series of "war of terror" arrests this weekend and Condi praising us, the timing can be seen as suspicious.
We don't have all the facts - I've heard the target was parliament, you are telling me near your house. Just another reason to wait and find out what the facts are.
Given that we seem to be looking for boogeymen to appease/justify a war on terror and forgetting the global picture.
Quote:
The raid that raised more questions than answers
Lawyers for two men arrested in an anti-terror raid in east London spoke out angrily as mystery deepened about the circumstances surrounding the operation which left one suspect with a gunshot wound
Recent police raids in Britain
More than 1,000 people have been arrested under the Terrorism Act in Britain since the US attacks on 11 September 2001 but only 121 have been charged and 23 convicted of terrorist offences
* 24 MAY: Eight Libyans arrested in raids in Manchester, Birmingham, London, Liverpool and Middlesbrough suspected of helping to plot and finance a Libyan terror group linked to al-Qa'ida. The investigation focused on the Sanabel Relief Agency, a charity which insists it merely channels funds for clean water and education projects in the developing world. Three men were held under the Terrorism Act and five under powers to deport people whose presence in the UK is "not conducive for reasons of national security".
RESULT: No charges or action so far.
* 6 MARCH: Four men arrested in a raid at a hall of residence at Bradford University on suspicion of involvement with al-Qa'ida.
RESULT: Four charged under the Terrorism Act, accused of downloading material from the internet that could be used in terrorist activities.
* 8 OCTOBER 2005: Ten men arrested on suspicion of being Islamic terrorists and helping to finance Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, The head of al-Qa'ida in Iraq. The raids in south London, Wolverhampton and Derby followed intelligence that the suspects may have been about to strike.
Adagio you appear to be unable to read. I find your incomprehension "hilarious".
Several in newspapers commented on the over the top circus the police put on as well and it's the hyberbole I'm commenting on - not the reality of the conspiracy. Security forces have a job to do - they did it - I don't need nor does society need the back slapping and hooraa - guns and leg irons nonsense from the police.
And Muslims here are not "surprised" either - they are the best Canadians to aid in sorting out issues with violence arising within their community.
You get this hoopla and then you get the crazies on the other side all worked up and you get mosques trashed. Brilliant
He stirs up the conflict with his own foolish show and then urge calm.......spare me
•••
There are many "threats" to society and resources need to be utilized accordingly, not according to a knee jerk reaction to a security "show and tell circus".
There are many more dire and immediate threats than terrorism and they don't get the high profile nonsense accompanying this. Why can't YOU understand that?
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and who is to say the gentleman quoted here is not correct??
Quote:
One Muslim leader suggested the arrests may have been timed to coincide with upcoming Supreme Court of Canada hearings into the constitutionality of security certificates, which allow the authorities to indefinitely detain, without charge, anyone considered a threat to national security.
“The timing is a little troubling,” said Zafar Bangash of the Institute of Contemporary Islamic Thought.
Lawyer Rocco Galati, who represents two of the men arrested on Friday, agreed that the timing of the arrests looked suspicious, as was the massive show of force Saturday when several of the suspects appeared in court.
Snipers could be seen atop neighbouring buildings, helicopters throbbed overhead and heavily armed police were all over the place, said Galati, who described the security measures as excessive.
“I’m not shy to say that I think this whole thing’s been timed, including the massive show of force, a little bit more than a week before the Supreme Court is to hear the appeals in Ottawa,” he said.
“The show of force in the courtroom, the number of officers, the helicopters, the snipers — it was excessive, and I think that’s a political attempt to obliquely influence the Supreme Court hearing next week, and their judgment.”
Farhad Oryakhim, 17, an employee at an east-end shop, said he’s concerned about how Muslims in Canada are going to be treated in the wake of the arrests.
“It’s going to be a pretty hard time now,” Oryakhim said. ``After this incident, people are going to look at the Muslims from a dangerous view.”
Oryakhim said he fears that non-Muslim customers will stop patronizing businesses in the area that are run by Muslims.
“It’s going to hurt our businesses,” he said. “Our life.”
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It appears to me that the police raid itself was more frightening for certain people posting here than the intent of the people who were arrested. Very interesting.
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