No agenda my ass....

Canada News: CBC cancels Connect and Dispatches in response to federal budget cuts - thestar.com (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1159268--cbc-cancels-connect-and-dispatches-in-response-to-federal-budget-cuts?bn=1) :mad:

This is exactly what he was elected for. While I can certainly understand your reaction (mine is similar), you can't really fault Harper and the conservatives for following through on what they either directly or indirectly promised to do, and what everyone expected them to do the moment they had a majority.

Anyone who voted for the conservatives had to know they were voting for increased military, increased corporate welfare (especially for the fossil fuel and crime industries), increased integration with the US (both socially and economically), and the gutting of social programs, health care, environmental protection, research funding, and most of all, the dismantling of the CBC.

Personally, I was surprised that so many of my fellow Canadians were in favour of this, but it was reassuring that the majority were not. Unfortunately, because of our broken electoral system, despite the majority of Canadians opposing the Conservatives, they still won a majority government. While we have every reason to be appalled at what the Conservatives are doing now that they have all the power they need, no one should be surprised.

The agenda rolls on .....shades of Mikey Harris.....wonder how many will die this time.....but gotta keep those oil and gas subsidies and we'll just delay those Parlimentary cuts for a while.

Food-safety workers among hardest-hit by Harper budget cuts
BILL CURRY
OTTAWA— From Wednesday's Globe and Mail
Published Wednesday, Apr. 11, 2012 4:00AM EDT
Last updated Wednesday, Apr. 11, 2012 4:14AM EDT

Veterinarians and other inspectors responsible for food recalls and ensuring the safety of Canadian meat are among the hundreds of federal public servants who will be told this week their jobs are at risk.

The Globe and Mail has learned that the Canadian Food Inspection Agency and Agriculture Canada will be among the hardest-hit departments as Ottawa rolls out where it will cut 19,200 jobs across the country.
Food-safety workers among hardest-hit by Harper budget cuts - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/food-safety-workers-among-hardest-hit-by-harper-budget-cuts/article2397854/)

but we CAN be appalled...

bryanc, only about half of what you say above is true. However, the CBC will cancel whatever it hopes will get a fairly strong reaction from the public--though I have to say that I don;t even know what those particular programs are. It's just like parks having their budgets cut. They always close washrooms and playground areas first to raise the biggest stink with the public.

The whole CBC thing just fascinates me. If this were 1954 I might understand people's consternation. In the thousand channel universe of 2012, not so much.

This is exactly what he was elected for. While I can certainly understand your reaction (mine is similar), you can't really fault Harper and the conservatives for following through on what they either directly or indirectly promised to do, and what everyone expected them to do the moment they had a majority.

Anyone who voted for the conservatives had to know they were voting for increased military, increased corporate welfare (especially for the fossil fuel and crime industries), increased integration with the US (both socially and economically), and the gutting of social programs, health care, environmental protection, research funding, and most of all, the dismantling of the CBC.

Personally, I was surprised that so many of my fellow Canadians were in favour of this, but it was reassuring that the majority were not. Unfortunately, because of our broken electoral system, despite the majority of Canadians opposing the Conservatives, they still won a majority government. While we have every reason to be appalled at what the Conservatives are doing now that they have all the power they need, no one should be surprised.

It seems pretty clear to me as well, no one should be surprised at any of this. But I'm sure there's a lot of people shocked at what the man patting the cute little kitty cat is doing though.

The whole CBC thing just fascinates me. If this were 1954 I might understand people's consternation. In the thousand channel universe of 2012, not so much.

Having only 2 english channels myself (CBC and CTV), I'm not really in a position to say, but I rather suspect the CBC is very different than any of those 999 other channels in that it is distinctively Canadian.

Like the first line of NASA's original mission statement ("To understand the home planet"... this was cut by the Bush administration, because they didn't like the science NASA did regarding Earth), CBC's mandate is to reflect Canada for Canadians. I think it's great that there is such a broad spectrum of entertainment out there for those who want it, but as a country of only a few tens of millions, Canada is an insignificant cultural market on the global scale. No one is going to cater to us because doing so will not be profitable. The costs of running the CBC are negligible, but serve an important purpose in defining and maintaining the Canadian identity.

Another aspect that is ignored is the role the CBC plays in incubating and fostering Canadian talent in the media arts and journalism. How many Canadian actors, comedians, musicians, and journalists do you think get their first significant public exposure through the CBC?

Another aspect that is ignored is the role the CBC plays in incubating and fostering Canadian talent in the media arts and journalism. How many Canadian actors, comedians, musicians, and journalists do you think get their first significant public exposure through the CBC?

I would say that is not the case anymore. The ratings for the CBC are weak. And the internet is more of a useful tool than the CBC could ever be. Example Justin Beiber. (Not that I listen to him, just an example)

I don't know how to feel about the CBC. CBC should be forced to live or die on its own sword. If it can't generate the $$ to sustain itself then if it falls so be it. I don't want it to but I want its shows to be judged on its own merits. Not be able to live because tax dollars are at work. If Canadians don't want to watch the shows which drive ad revenue then cuts have to be made.

On the other hand there are many industries which depend on tax dollars (breaks) to operate in Canada which provide jobs and lively hood for many people. What does the CBC do? Why do we as a nation need to be told who we are as a nation and what is Canadian? Almost feels like communism to me. What’s the difference?

So is it important to spend tax dollars on something that most Canadians don't want? The ratings would say that most Canadians don't watch the CBC and you can't look past that so to me that means they don't want the CBC.

The ratings would say that most Canadians don't watch the CBC and you can't look past that so to me that means they don't want the CBC.

I'm not sure that's the case. If Fox makes a show, they get the benefit of a much larger potential viewing population (of which Canadians make up a tiny minority), and therefore can afford much greater budgets and taking risks on shows that may flop. When CBC makes a show, they have to do so with a much smaller budget, knowing that even if they have a hit, they're never going to make anywhere near the kind of money the networks they compete against will. So it's not a level playing feild. Furthermore, CBC isn't going to be making the kinds of shows that make HBO or Fox epic piles of cash, because the CBC does not exist to make money, it exists to reflect Canada (hopefully in an occasionally entertaining way).

Personally, the only things I ever watch on TV are HNIC and the National, so it's not a big deal to me one way or another. But I think the argument that CBC should be "competing" in the market like any other broadcaster is specious.

I would say that is not the case anymore. The ratings for the CBC are weak. And the internet is more of a useful tool than the CBC could ever be. Example Justin Beiber. (Not that I listen to him, just an example)

I don't know how to feel about the CBC. CBC should be forced to live or die on its own sword. If it can't generate the $$ to sustain itself then if it falls so be it. I don't want it to but I want its shows to be judged on its own merits. Not be able to live because tax dollars are at work. If Canadians don't want to watch the shows which drive ad revenue then cuts have to be made.

On the other hand there are many industries which depend on tax dollars (breaks) to operate in Canada which provide jobs and lively hood for many people. What does the CBC do? Why do we as a nation need to be told who we are as a nation and what is Canadian? Almost feels like communism to me. What’s the difference?

So is it important to spend tax dollars on something that most Canadians don't want? The ratings would say that most Canadians don't watch the CBC and you can't look past that so to me that means they don't want the CBC.

clearly you don't work in the entertainment industry.

The CBC still plays a big role as it has for some time. Justin Beiber notwithstanding.

clearly you don't work in the entertainment industry.

The CBC still plays a big role as it has for some time. Justin Beiber notwithstanding.

Sure it does--as an agent of entertainment welfare.

The costs of running the CBC are negligible, but serve an important purpose in defining and maintaining the Canadian identity.

Once again, if you feel that you need television to help prop up your sense of national identity, send them 25 skins--or 50 if you're feeling generous. The decision did not eradicate the CBC, just two programs.

But you were initially arguing that the majority of Canadians did not elect the Conservatives, so this decision is foul. I would say that the majority of Canadians did not watch those two programs, so canceling them is fair.

clearly you don't work in the entertainment industry.

The CBC still plays a big role as it has for some time. Justin Beiber notwithstanding.

So CBC should only exist for those in the arts and media so they can get a start?

Look I can guarantee you with absolute certainty that if the Liberals were in office the same cuts would be made to the CBC. It makes no difference.

And bryanc like you I only watch HNIC and the National most of the time. if it exists just for those then fine. I did watch a show called The Border a couple of years ago. Don't know if it is still on.

Once again, if you feel that you need television to help prop up your sense of national identity, send them 25 skins--or 50 if you're feeling generous. The decision did not eradicate the CBC, just two programs.

But you were initially arguing that the majority of Canadians did not elect the Conservatives, so this decision is foul. I would say that the majority of Canadians did not watch those two programs, so canceling them is fair.

What are you talking about? I was merely responding to the post that said the CBC isn't effective anymore in helping artists.

So CBC should only exist for those in the arts and media so they can get a start?

Look I can guarantee you with absolute certainty that if the Liberals were in office the same cuts would be made to the CBC. It makes no difference.

And bryanc like you I only watch HNIC and the National most of the time. if it exists just for those then fine. I did watch a show called The Border a couple of years ago. Don't know if it is still on.
Who said the CBC should exist -only- for the artists to get their start?

Who said the CBC should exist -only- for the artists to get their start?

from your quote

The CBC still plays a big role as it has for some time. Justin Beiber notwithstanding.

Maybe I miss understood you.

And bryanc like you I only watch HNIC and the National most of the time. if it exists just for those then fine. I did watch a show called The Border a couple of years ago. Don't know if it is still on.

It really would make essentially no difference to me (personally) if CBC TV were completely eliminated, as I can watch hockey on line, and get plenty of news online as well. (We went for almost 30 years with no TV at all, and only recently purchased one to use as a monitor for our PS3... the fact that I can pick up CBC and CTV are simply bonuses).

So, like paying taxes to support OAS, welfare, the educations system, public healthcare, food inspectors, police, environmental protection, etc. etc. etc. I view the tiny fraction of my tax dollars that go towards funding the CBC as an investment in the community - in my Country - and I'm happy to pay it. Indeed, like most Canadians, I'd be happy to pay *more* taxes for these things.

But under King Harper, my taxes are being diverted away from the things that make Canada great (which include, but are by no means limited to the CBC), and towards things that make Canada worse (like expanding the military, expanding the prison system, and providing tax breaks to obscenely profitable and environmentally unsustainable corporations).

The Conservatives are doing everything they can to ruin the country.

Having only 2 english channels myself (CBC and CTV), I'm not really in a position to say, but I rather suspect the CBC is very different than any of those 999 other channels in that it is distinctively Canadian.

Such a shame that you have not broadened your horizons to see real Canadian produced channels that put anything the CBC does to shame:

Oasis HD - Love Nature! (http://www.oasishd.ca/)
eqhd - it's smart in here (http://www.eqhd.ca/)
HIFI - music + art (http://www.hifi.ca/)
radX - Risk. Adventure. Danger. (http://www.radx.ca/)

The documentaries, extreme sports, arts, nature and human studies broadcasts are stunning in full HD and a real credit to the Canadians that make those four interconnected channels possible. Much of their programming is educational in nature as well as inspiring. You are missing the very best TV in the country, all commercial free and paid for by subscribers, just like the CBC should be.

from your quote



Maybe I miss understood you.

yes you did. They certainly do play a big role. I'm not sure how you interpreted that to say, they exist -only- for this purpose.

Far from it.

Such a shame that you have not broadened your horizons to see real Canadian produced channels that put anything the CBC does to shame:

Oasis HD - Love Nature! (http://www.oasishd.ca/)
eqhd - it's smart in here (http://www.eqhd.ca/)
HIFI - music + art (http://www.hifi.ca/)
radX - Risk. Adventure. Danger. (http://www.radx.ca/)

The documentaries, extreme sports, arts, nature and human studies broadcasts are stunning in full HD and a real credit to the Canadians that make those four interconnected channels possible. Much of their programming is educational in nature as well as inspiring. You are missing the very best TV in the country, all commercial free and paid for by subscribers, just like the CBC should be.

I don't think anyone is saying no one else produces Canadian content.

It really would make essentially no difference to me (personally) if CBC TV were completely eliminated, as I can watch hockey on line, and get plenty of news online as well. (We went for almost 30 years with no TV at all, and only recently purchased one to use as a monitor for our PS3... the fact that I can pick up CBC and CTV are simply bonuses).

So, like paying taxes to support OAS, welfare, the educations system, public healthcare, food inspectors, police, environmental protection, etc. etc. etc. I view the tiny fraction of my tax dollars that go towards funding the CBC as an investment in the community - in my Country - and I'm happy to pay it. Indeed, like most Canadians, I'd be happy to pay *more* taxes for these things.

Agree on this part.

Such a shame that you have not broadened your horizons to see real Canadian produced channels that put anything the CBC does to shame:

Oasis HD - Love Nature! (http://www.oasishd.ca/)
eqhd - it's smart in here (http://www.eqhd.ca/)
HIFI - music + art (http://www.hifi.ca/)
radX - Risk. Adventure. Danger. (http://www.radx.ca/)

The documentaries, extreme sports, arts, nature and human studies broadcasts are stunning in full HD and a real credit to the Canadians that make those four interconnected channels possible. Much of their programming is educational in nature as well as inspiring. You are missing the very best TV in the country, all commercial free and paid for by subscribers, just like the CBC should be.

Totally agree. Is TVO a gov funded channel? Because they sometimes have great shows on there. The other day watched Ancient Worlds on there and set the PVR to record the other 5 episodes. Also set the PVR to record Eco Engineering: Geo Thermal: Energy From Within.

Just been thinking, are all tv shows produced in Canada given tax credits? So therefore by extension they receive tax dollars. At the end of most tv shows it displays something silimiar to "funded in part by tax credits".

quite a few. The notion that all this great Canadian content programming is all funded by subscribers is incorrect.

quite a few. The notion that all this great Canadian content programming is all funded by subscribers is incorrect.

So then let the CBC be.

Such a shame that you have not broadened your horizons to see...{other Canadian content}

Those look interesting. If I ever have time to spare to watch TV, I may check them out. And I hope my tax dollars continue to support the production of Canadian content, even if I never get to watch it myself.

Because the majority of Canadians want the CBC to be what it is. Doing what you suggest would completely gut the CBC as it exists today.

Of course those that despise the CBC will hide behind this idea that everyone else does it without government funding, but it simply isn't true.

Because the majority of Canadians want the CBC to be what it is. Doing what you suggest would completely gut the CBC as it exists today.

Of course those that despise the CBC will hide behind this idea that everyone else does it without government funding, but it simply isn't true.

I totally forgot or ignored or didn't realize that many shows I watch are funded by the government. So as the kids say, my bad.

Just been thinking, are all tv shows produced in Canada given tax credits? So therefore by extension they receive tax dollars. At the end of most tv shows it displays something silimiar to "funded in part by tax credits".

Yes. That's why I argue that no business should receive a subsidy--entertainment, oil or wind power. They should just deduct the normal costs of doing business from their income.

Yes. That's why I argue that no business should receive a subsidy--entertainment, oil or wind power. They should just deduct the normal costs of doing business from their income.

I have no arguemnt for that in general but then many jobs would not exist here. They would just be moved away at a greater pace then what is happening. And that is a different topic.

Perhaps Stephen Harper should run his next election campaign on that very thing. Or we need a federal "wildrose party" if he isn't dumb enough to do so.
;)

I have no arguemnt for that in general but then many jobs would not exist here. They would just be moved away at a greater pace then what is happening. And that is a different topic.

Jobs are not moving away from Canada. Our employment record is really good. But that IS a different topic.

Hey everyone, jobs are not being moved offshore.

More at 11.
;)

ok ok, I'll stop responding to the nonsense now :)

Hey everyone, jobs are not being moved offshore.

More at 11.
;)

ok ok, I'll stop responding to the nonsense now :)

Your comment itself is nonsense. Low paying jobs will continue to be outsourced because the skill sets of people in those countries now equals or exceeds our own. However, we are creating more jobs in sustainable fields than we are outsourcing.

what sort of sustainable fields are we talking about?

what sort of sustainable fields are we talking about?

Natural resource management and extraction, water treatment and distribution technologies, advanced medical technologies, and specialty manufacturing to name a few.

well that certainly sounds like a recipe for high employment numbers for the citizens of Canada!

well that certainly sounds like a recipe for high employment numbers for the citizens of Canada!

It's working out well, yes. However, it isn't a recipe. It's the natural inclination of businesses to seek out areas of opportunity. The hiring is a result of those opportunities--not the reason for it.

well that certainly sounds like a recipe for high employment numbers for the citizens of Canada!

It's working out for people who aren't afraid of a little hard work, getting their hands dirty, or actually producing something, for sure.

Not too sure about those who consider themselves above such things though.

It's working out for people who aren't afraid of a little hard work, getting their hands dirty, or actually producing something, for sure.

Not too sure about those who consider themselves above such things though.

Well I don't think many of the more menial less skilled jobs fleeing the country are any less hard work, or certainly getting your hands dirty. That sounds like a bit of a generalization to me. :) Are those who "work in the mines" the only ones that produce anything? Really?

No, but there does seem to be a culture of entitlement, with many people expecting someone else to 'give them a job' (ideally where they live, with good benefits).

There is a shortage of skilled trades (plumbers, millwrights, electricians). That's what I meant by a little hard work and getting your hands dirty. But we certainly need to provide the opportunity for apprenticeship programs, etc.

Innovators are the ones who develop new categories of employment, and are willing to take the associated risks. That's where government incentives, (perhaps in the form of deferred taxes or tax credits) might come into play. Like it or not, the engine of our current economy is not the CBC.

Canada is a land of unlimited potential, the envy of many other parts of the world. We have natural resources, and all we need is a workforce that is willing to adapt to the new reality instead of clinging to outmoded thinking.

No, but there does seem to be a culture of entitlement, with many people expecting someone else to 'give them a job' (ideally where they live, with good benefits).

There is a shortage of skilled trades (plumbers, millwrights, electricians). That's what I meant by a little hard work and getting your hands dirty. But we certainly need to provide the opportunity for apprenticeship programs, etc.

Innovators are the ones who develop new categories of employment, and are willing to take the associated risks. That's where government incentives, (perhaps in the form of deferred taxes or tax credits) might come into play. Like it or not, the engine of our current economy is not the CBC.

Canada is a land of unlimited potential, the envy of many other parts of the world. We have natural resources, and all we need is a workforce that is willing to adapt to the new reality instead of clinging to outmoded thinking.

I don't disagree with your points. And I didn't want to suggest the CBC was anywhere near, the engine of our economy, by any means. It's merely only one, of many many pieces of the huge puzzle.

Small businesses are very much the engine in this country.

No, but there does seem to be a culture of entitlement, with many people expecting someone else to 'give them a job' (ideally where they live, with good benefits).

There is a shortage of skilled trades (plumbers, millwrights, electricians). That's what I meant by a little hard work and getting your hands dirty. But we certainly need to provide the opportunity for apprenticeship programs, etc.

Innovators are the ones who develop new categories of employment, and are willing to take the associated risks. That's where government incentives, (perhaps in the form of deferred taxes or tax credits) might come into play. Like it or not, the engine of our current economy is not the CBC.

Canada is a land of unlimited potential, the envy of many other parts of the world. We have natural resources, and all we need is a workforce that is willing to adapt to the new reality instead of clinging to outmoded thinking.I should take exception to the comment "unlimited potential." Our environment and natural resources especially have a finite limit.

Brunswick Mines in Northern NB was a world class underground Zinc mine that has been in production for nearly fifty years but will be soon ending operations. The zinc was finite, the bitumin is indeed finite, oil and gas are finite.

Even soil and the oceans are finite if not looked after.

You are thinking too small. Finitely. 'What we know'.

There are things that we don't even know exist, but they exist despite our current ignorance. Potential is limited only by our puny brains and inability to think beyond what we know. Canada's natural resources may be finite, but Canada's potential is unlimited because we have the strong basis of civilisation to work from - good infrastructure. We're not scrabbling each day just to 'survive', but have the potential to thrive.

Innovation is 'finding a need (or want) and meeting it', not just mining more ore.

Potential is limited only by our puny brains and inability to think beyond what we know.
Well that, and physics... but yeah, I get your point.

At any rate, it seems pretty clear that the current government is more concerned about the profitability of the Chinese companies that own the oil sands than they are about the environment or the futures of the Canadian citizens who will have to live with the consequences of the "unfettered free market" and it's efficient extraction of natural resources.

Well that, and physics... but yeah, I get your point.

At any rate, it seems pretty clear that the current government is more concerned about the profitability of the Chinese companies that own the oil sands than they are about the environment or the futures of the Canadian citizens who will have to live with the consequences of the "unfettered free market" and it's efficient extraction of natural resources.

That would seem clear to you. It seems clear to me that these interests are pretty well balanced. Extraction form the oil sands is based on the idea that the market will exist for the product for about a 25-year timespan. I doubt leaving it in the ground makes any sort of sense,

well balanced? Bulldozing over any environmental concerns in favour of more profits is hardly, 'well balanced'.

well balanced? Bulldozing over any environmental concerns in favour of more profits is hardly, 'well balanced'.

Neither is your statement. There are significant environmental considerations given to the operations--perhaps not enough for you, but they are there nonetheless.

You're right. They are not enough for me, nor are they enough for many Canadians.

It's hard to believe that anyone, would assume corporations, and governments can be trusted to make decisions that would be in the best interests of the citizen's health and wellbeing.

You're right. They are not enough for me, nor are they enough for many Canadians.

It's hard to believe that anyone, would assume corporations, and governments can be trusted to make decisions that would be in the best interests of the citizen's health and wellbeing.

I make the best decisions for my health and wellbeing. Nobody acts in my best interests, except largely by accident.

No you don't. You give others a free pass to affect the air you breathe and the water/food you consume.

No you don't. You give others a free pass to affect the air you breathe and the water/food you consume.

Is that so? thank you for sharing that with me.

seriously disgusting abuse of power by Harper and cronies

Seeking to blunt Conservative attacks, Suzuki quits board of environmental foundation - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/seeking-to-blunt-conservative-attacks-suzuki-quits-board-of-environmental-foundation/article2400300/)

foul :mad:

seriously disgusting abuse of power by Harper and cronies

Seeking to blunt Conservative attacks, Suzuki quits board of environmental foundation - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/seeking-to-blunt-conservative-attacks-suzuki-quits-board-of-environmental-foundation/article2400300/)

foul :mad:

Blame Suzuki for that organization's bad press. He's been behaving like a lunatic for the pat few years.

That would seem clear to you. It seems clear to me that these interests are pretty well balanced. Extraction form the oil sands is based on the idea that the market will exist for the product for about a 25-year timespan. I doubt leaving it in the ground makes any sort of sense,

Lots of issues with the tar/oil sands. Really is too thick to call oil and a tad too thin to be called tar.

Big issue from Alberta taxpayers viewpoint is almost zero royalties in exchange for a lot of environmental damage. Tar sands players could be paying decent royalties and making good profits.

Also makes zero sense not to do at least a sizeable portion of the refining on the spot.

Harper throws National Council of Welfare on the scrap heap (http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/1160732--harper-throws-national-council-of-welfare-on-the-scrap-heap)

Deeply buried in an attachment to the 2012 budget was a one-sentence announcement that the National Council of Welfare had been axed.

(SNIP)

Since 1962, the National Council of Welfare had held up a mirror to the nation, highlighting the pockets of poverty and warning policy-makers of the consequences of neglecting those in need. It gave non-profit groups the facts they needed to speak credibly about hardship in a land of plenty. It tracked the emergence and growth of a crack in society between the comfortably well-off and the struggling. And it brought together social policy thinkers to find solutions to poverty — or at least keep the debate alive.

Now it’s gone. Kellie Leitch, parliamentary secretary to the minister of human resources, dismissed the loss offhandedly. “We are putting our policy resources to best use and reducing duplication,” she said, pointing to Campaign 2000 and Canada Without Poverty as high-profile non-profit organizations serving the same role.

Actually they don’t. They don’t have a government mandate “to advise the (human resources) minister on matters concerning poverty and the realities of low-income Canadians.” They don’t have the resources to buy Statistics Canada’s unpublished data. They don’t have the statutory authority to create opportunities for the poor to participate in the national decision-making process.

(Toronto Star (http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/1160732--harper-throws-national-council-of-welfare-on-the-scrap-heap))

Also makes zero sense not to do at least a sizeable portion of the refining on the spot.

Makes lots of sense not to refine it on the spot--considering the cost of setting up new refineries and the uncertain market for the product. All it takes is a dip in the price of oil to send that region ducking for economic cover.

Since 1962, the National Council of Welfare had held up a mirror to the nation...

60 years is a long time to be holding up a mirror--they deserve a hard-earned rest.

Harper throws National Council of Welfare on the scrap heap (http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/1160732--harper-throws-national-council-of-welfare-on-the-scrap-heap)



(Toronto Star (http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/1160732--harper-throws-national-council-of-welfare-on-the-scrap-heap))

the lap puppies are fine with all this slash and burn, and the turning of all attentions and considerations to the corporations in this country, of course the foreign ones as well! In fact they're applauding it. The continued actions to remove more freedoms and protections to Canadian citizens is seen as inevitable, welcome. It's a rather strange, strange breed of libertarianism not seen before. Never, have I seen them to welcome the reduction of freedom for the country's citizen so wholeheartedly before. They're like automatons, doing their best to dispel anyone's fears on each and every news item of this government's actions.

^

Did Macdoc change his avatar?

seriously disgusting abuse of power by Harper and cronies

Seeking to blunt Conservative attacks, Suzuki quits board of environmental foundation - The Globe and Mail (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/seeking-to-blunt-conservative-attacks-suzuki-quits-board-of-environmental-foundation/article2400300/)

foul :mad:

The article is misleading. Suzuki actually left the board almost a year ago, a while before the Ontario provincial election.
Suzuki Foundation in election controversy | News | Ontario Votes | Ottawa Sun (http://www.ottawasun.com/2011/09/20/suzuki-foundation-in-election-controversy)

The Globe needs to try reporting the facts.

^

Did Macdoc change his avatar?

Ha! I was wondering the same thing!

the lap puppies are fine with all this slash and burn, and the turning of all attentions and considerations to the corporations in this country, of course the foreign ones as well! In fact they're applauding it. The continued actions to remove more freedoms and protections to Canadian citizens is seen as inevitable, welcome. It's a rather strange, strange breed of libertarianism not seen before. Never, have I seen them to welcome the reduction of freedom for the country's citizen so wholeheartedly before. They're like automatons, doing their best to dispel anyone's fears on each and every news item of this government's actions.

Never have I seen someone with their thought process so mired in socialism that they equate forcing others to pay for welfare with freedom.

Oh the big bad word, sooooocialism! If you dare believe that the citizens of Canada should be considered as a priority as opposed to the corporate socialism being currently favored, just slam them with the socialist word.

If believing in the investing in the people of Canada, promoting their rights and freedoms as opposed to stripping it, handing it all to the top corporate interests both domestic, and foreign, then go ahead and attach whatever word you like to it.

You just keep apologizing for the corporate socialism all you like. Just make yourself feel better by stating you don't believe in that either... lol.

Your post makes no sense at all. Try to stay on topic. Why does scrapping the National Council on Welfare result in "the reduction of freedom for the country's citizen [sic]"

whenever it goes where you don't want to, you just run and hide behind the 'it doesn't make any sense'.

If you want to stay on topic, perhaps you can explain how opposing this makes one a socialist. We'll start there.

Opposing what?

You seem to be having trouble following a conversation. When you're done being a troll, it can resume.

You seem to be having trouble following a conversation. When you're done being a troll, it can resume.

Settle down and read the thread again. Ask specific questions and then maybe we can have a conversation. Until then, your posts are simply too disorganized and non-specific to know what you're talking about at any given time. While these ideas may be pretty clear to you as you're thinking them through, something is lost by the time you post.

Well since we were talking about National Council on Welfare specifically, I would have assumed you wouldn't suddenly the next post over have a brain melt and forget what we were talking about.

Such is conversation with the 'fury however.

So you're saying that the National Council on Welfare promotes freedom?