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BC to return to PST, why can't we?

2K views 41 replies 12 participants last post by  kelman 
#1 ·
#2 · (Edited)
Because

(A) it is a much more efficient way of doing things. The rules for the calculation of PST for small businesses in the old system were incredibly complicated. For example, if I sat beside someone and told them which keys to press on their computer to change a setting to software that I had sold them, there was no PST on the service I was charging them. However if they asked me to make the changes for them, I was expected to charge them PST. If I did work for a customer and transferred the files electronically, there was no PST charged on the work. However if I provided them with a CD or DVD that contained those same files, by law I was supposed to charge them PST.

(B) Businesses needed to submit two separate tax reports to two separate governing bodies, usually at different times (i.e. one quarterly and the other semi-annually).

(C) Quite often businesses ended up paying Tax on Tax with purchases made to run the business and weren't able to recoup those taxes. The rules were complicated and confusing for what was considered to be a PST Exempt purchase. With the HST system, it is simple and there is no Tax on Tax.

(D) It cost businesses a lot of money to have computer systems, cash registers, etc. switched from GST+PST to HST. It would cost them again to switch the system back to GST+PST. It's a cost of doing business that ultimately gets charged to their clients in some form.

(E) There is little if any benefit to switching back to a combined tax for the consumer. The fact is that 83 per cent of goods and services in Ontario won’t face a change in the amount of tax levied. Of the remaining 17%, about the only thing that is not a discretionary purchase would be Residential electricity and heating. The rest is made up of things like Alcohol and Tobacco, Gasoline, Landscaping, Snow Removal, Golf Greens Fees, Hotel Rooms, etc. (Source)

There is way too much bureaucracy in the overall tax system in this country. This was one of the smartest things that was done to reduce the levels of bureaucracy. Why would you want to increase it again?
 
#4 ·
Not everyone in BC is happy with the return to the two-tax system.

As a business owner I'll be buying any business-related material before April, 2013, so I can claim the HST back, and then after April, 2013, go back to buying in Alberta whenever possible.

I'm not looking forward to having to submit different taxes to different agencies again, either.

For some reason some people think that eliminating the HST means that there will be less tax. The only difference to the average consumer when the HST was brought in was the addition of the tax on 'restaurant meals' and a few other items. If the Liberals had been thinking they would have just admitted they tried for the tax grab and lowered the overall rate, or made those items which were exempt under PST exempt under HST. What a colossal waste of time and taxpayer money.

Just goes to show that people, in general, are stupid.
 
#5 ·
Absolutely agreed. Show people that they'll win some and lose some, but in the end it's a wash. I would prefer that one lower rate apply to absolutely everything--food and prescription drugs as well.
 
#25 ·
I do get that, and that there is some tax benefits to the business. I've already seen this. However, that often gets negated when your clients cry that the invoice is now too high (even though they likely can claim this too) because, the perception is, suddenly you're more expensive. I realize again, in theory, it may make sense. But perception is everything at times.

I think in theory what you're saying is correct, but in practice, I can tell you a different story. Many of my peers have complained about the same thing.

I'm also paying more out in personal expenses that I can't claim. In the end, we are getting fleeced for more tax dollars. Which is why I'll agree with some posters about saving a point off the HST.
 
#29 ·
I do get that, and that there is some tax benefits to the business. I've already seen this. However, that often gets negated when your clients cry that the invoice is now too high (even though they likely can claim this too) because, the perception is, suddenly you're more expensive. I realize again, in theory, it may make sense. But perception is everything at times. ...
Sorry, but it sounds like your argument is that PST should be re-implemented because your clients are as dumb as box of hammers! ;)

I bill my time; I'm in the same position; the bottom line on my bills went up. The folks I deal with know that GST is recoverable--there was no backlash. BTW, since I bill (and collect) regularly but only file and remit quarterly, I've had that money in my hot little hands for a couple of months before I remit it. In that sense, it can actually help a small business' cash flow!

More to the point though, PST was a nightmare. There was a huge compliance and audi department (hugely costly, too) because the legislation was vague and full of grey areas. Was the good used in production, then it was exempt. What if you bought it for production but then used some in administration? ... Costly and time-consuming for companies to keep up on the rules, deal with auditors and stay in compliance. Much better to have only one (slightly simpler) system to deal with.

Craig
 
#26 ·
I am just a tax collector for those who can't see fit to do their job, and then they tell me to collect more. How is it that there is no difference from then to now when I charge you $200 for a service call and 5% tax then to $200 service call and 13% tax now? Are you saying that the consumer pays no difference? Fire your calculator.
 
#33 ·
The thread title should be more like "BC returns to the dark ages, hopefully Ontario doesn't follow."

I'm angry my fellow British Columbians would be so stupid and shortsighted to not see the HST as good or business and good for the economy. I run a small business on the side and would rather not have to spend so much time on accounting and paperwork... so now they've voted to double my sales tax return paperwork.
 
#34 ·
I'm angry my fellow British Columbians would be so stupid and shortsighted to not see the HST as good or business and good for the economy. I run a small business on the side and would rather not have to spend so much time on accounting and paperwork... so now they've voted to double my sales tax return paperwork.
Sorry they didn't consider you when they were getting their lost money back.
 
#36 ·
Being a small business owner the hst has not helped me at all. Because my business is service based I never charged pst to begin with. I agree with a unified tax system but they should have brought it down a percent or two. However given the state of Ontario's deficit the hst is going nowhere any time soon.
 
#42 ·
I understand the theory in all the HST support - for business. I am a small business owner who deals directly with those people who are now paying me more for the same job thanks to the extra tax. Once just 5% is now 13%, this was my original thought when I started this thread. I also do service work for many companies and yes the tax is no different or now better but it still weighs heavily on the side of the government and I am just an unpaid tax collector. As an end user though and a consumer I hated the thought of it coming in and still ahem it enough to want it reversed. Those that keep saying it will cost money to revert - when does it not cost money for the overpaid political has-beens to make choices for us thinking it will do us good? No choice in the matter and then a few years later someone else takes the limelight only to scrap what our tax dollars just paid for and come up with a simpler expensive plan/project that will save us in the end?
 
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