More on Apple and Adobe Flash

DavidH · Feb 5th, 2010, 11:02 AM

Here is an interesting article on why Apple is not supporting Adobe Flash.

If any of this is true then you can understand why Apple is taking its position and not implementing Adobe Flash.

Yet more info on why Apple's dissing Adobe | 9 to 5 Mac

DavidH

chas_m · Feb 5th, 2010, 11:23 AM

Supporting evidence from Adobe itself (in a manner of speaking):

The Flash saga continues: Adobe responds to charges of "laziness"

As mentioned in this article, even Firefox Mobile (which is NOT mac-native) doesn't support Flash BECAUSE ITS BUGGY AND UNSTABLE.

Bottom line: the problem isn't Apple; it's Adobe.

screature · Feb 5th, 2010, 11:49 AM

Very interesting indeed. I would tend to agree that Adobe has become bloated and lazy. They have been making refinements to their product line-up but I can't say that I have seen anything truly exciting from them in years and years... Well aside from Lightroom that is.

i-rui · Feb 5th, 2010, 12:15 PM

Even if Adobe has become lazy and flash is a resource hog on macs i still think Apple has to work WITH them to bring flash to the iphone (if possible) and ESPECIALLY to the ipad (for which i would consider it necessary).

Perhaps something as simple as "click to flash" for the ipad to at least give the end user an option of viewing WANTED flash content while not using resources for random flash content.

Apple is dreaming if they think that flash will vanish from the internet by march (or several years) just because they want it gone. If the ipad is going to be the ultimate web surfer it HAS to be able to view flash content.

Both sides have points to their argument. Hopefully this is all just posturing by both sides and something can be worked out together.

MannyP Design · Feb 5th, 2010, 01:20 PM

Seems like the pot is calling kettle black given the issues Apple has found itself in recent history.

MannyP Design · Feb 5th, 2010, 01:33 PM

You have to hand it to Jobs, he's performed the oldest trick in the world flawlessly: Misdirection. I mean, this is WAY better than his reality distortion field.

Jobs has passed the buck to Adobe in the hopes people will be distracted enough to forget the shortcomings of the iPad. The premise that the iPad is signaling the death of Flash is idiotic at best. Even if iPad sales break a percent of the entire computing market, it still won't put a dent in Flash usage.

Jobs wants you to believe that proprietary is bad… unless it's from Apple.

Next thing you know he'll blame Photoshop as the reason why Safari runs animated GIFs so bloody poorly.

Vexel · Feb 5th, 2010, 02:10 PM

The number one reason people think that not having flash on the iPhone/iPad is a bad idea is because of video. WIth the release of HTML5, this is going to be a moot point. Especially since it runs video so much better.

I have no use for flash at all on my phone.. in fact, i can't remember the last time that i needed to run flash on a site. (for my own intentions.)

This video is amazing.. for those who haven't seen it.

Jilion - SublimeVideo

groovetube · Feb 5th, 2010, 02:29 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by i-rui
	Even if Adobe has become lazy and flash is a resource hog on macs i still think Apple has to work WITH them to bring flash to the iphone (if possible) and ESPECIALLY to the ipad (for which i would consider it necessary). Perhaps something as simple as "click to flash" for the ipad to at least give the end user an option of viewing WANTED flash content while not using resources for random flash content. Apple is dreaming if they think that flash will vanish from the internet by march (or several years) just because they want it gone. If the ipad is going to be the ultimate web surfer it HAS to be able to view flash content. Both sides have points to their argument. Hopefully this is all just posturing by both sides and something can be worked out together.

Well said. At least there is some saneness to the melee of "I HATE FLASH! DONNO WHY! BUT I HATE FLASH!

I've been developing in flash since flash 3, and I know well the flaws in adobe. All of us developers wish much of it would get addressed. Believe me. Some of the criticisms, are quite valid. Some, makes me scratch my head and wonder why people even bother to open their mouth.

	Quote:			Originally Posted by Vexel
	The number one reason people think that not having flash on the iPhone/iPad is a bad idea is because of video. WIth the release of HTML5, this is going to be a moot point. Especially since it runs video so much better. I have no use for flash at all on my phone.. in fact, i can't remember the last time that i needed to run flash on a site. (for my own intentions.) This video is amazing.. for those who haven't seen it. Jilion - SublimeVideo

Vexel, you have to understand, it isn't that the video runs sooo much better in HTML5. They are both, the same thing, H.264. Adobe began supporting that long ago, in order to facilitate choice, so that it wasn't necessary for video sites to require multiple versions and gobble up more resources.

The problem is, in html5 the H.264 can utilize hardware acceleration, but apple refuses to allow access to the required APIs to let flash utilize hardware acceleration as well. Hence, the crappier performance.

Personally, I don't really care if flash is ever on the phone. When it comes to computer replacements like the ipad, and up, it pisses me off to have someone like Steve Jobs declare a platform I happen to not only develop in, but really actually like, as dead. Now I realize 640k was enough for everybody at one point, but I personally love a great interactive site. HTML5, simple cannot reproduce that.

Oh, here's some HTML5 goodness coming our way apparently. Radiohead House of Cards HTML5 Voxel Experiment
Helloooooo flash er... 2...

i-rui · Feb 5th, 2010, 02:33 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by Vexel
	This video is amazing.. for those who haven't seen it. Jilion - SublimeVideo

that video IS VERY impressive. Looks great!

But there is more to flash than video. Games and animations still work great on flash but AFAIK don't have any other REAL comparable replacement.

screature · Feb 5th, 2010, 06:14 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by i-rui
	Even if Adobe has become lazy and flash is a resource hog on macs i still think Apple has to work WITH them to bring flash to the iphone (if possible) and ESPECIALLY to the ipad (for which i would consider it necessary). Perhaps something as simple as "click to flash" for the ipad to at least give the end user an option of viewing WANTED flash content while not using resources for random flash content. Apple is dreaming if they think that flash will vanish from the internet by march (or several years) just because they want it gone. If the ipad is going to be the ultimate web surfer it HAS to be able to view flash content. Both sides have points to their argument. Hopefully this is all just posturing by both sides and something can be worked out together.

Yes I tend to agree i-rui. However, I think this is a volley over Adobes bow from Apple saying "Get with it, you aren't web standards compliant so at least get you code in order to make things run consistently and fast."

We will see how Adobe responds.

Feb 5th, 2010, 11:02 AM	#1
DavidH Full Citizen Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Hamilton, Ontario Posts: 175	More on Apple and Adobe Flash Here is an interesting article on why Apple is not supporting Adobe Flash. If any of this is true then you can understand why Apple is taking its position and not implementing Adobe Flash. Yet more info on why Apple's dissing Adobe \| 9 to 5 Mac DavidH

Feb 5th, 2010, 11:23 AM	#2
chas_m Honourable Citizen Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Victoria BC Posts: 11,323	Supporting evidence from Adobe itself (in a manner of speaking): The Flash saga continues: Adobe responds to charges of "laziness" As mentioned in this article, even Firefox Mobile (which is NOT mac-native) doesn't support Flash BECAUSE ITS BUGGY AND UNSTABLE. Bottom line: the problem isn't Apple; it's Adobe. __________________ Cheers chas_m Evangelist, ACDSee Pro for Mac: Get the beta! Join the community! Help us build the next great Mac photo manager! Our life in Victoria BC • Music blog • My Podcast • Film blog Victoria Macintosh Users Group

Feb 5th, 2010, 11:49 AM	#3
screature Honourable Citizen Join Date: May 2007 Location: Aylmer (Gatineau) across the river from Ottawa Posts: 7,412	Very interesting indeed. I would tend to agree that Adobe has become bloated and lazy. They have been making refinements to their product line-up but I can't say that I have seen anything truly exciting from them in years and years... Well aside from Lightroom that is. __________________ Mac Pro Quad 2.66GHz Gen 1.1 MacIntel Mini 2009 Core 2 Duo 2.26GHZ MacIntel Mini 1.83GHz

Feb 5th, 2010, 12:15 PM	#4
i-rui Honourable Citizen Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,617	Even if Adobe has become lazy and flash is a resource hog on macs i still think Apple has to work WITH them to bring flash to the iphone (if possible) and ESPECIALLY to the ipad (for which i would consider it necessary). Perhaps something as simple as "click to flash" for the ipad to at least give the end user an option of viewing WANTED flash content while not using resources for random flash content. Apple is dreaming if they think that flash will vanish from the internet by march (or several years) just because they want it gone. If the ipad is going to be the ultimate web surfer it HAS to be able to view flash content. Both sides have points to their argument. Hopefully this is all just posturing by both sides and something can be worked out together. __________________ www.i-rui.com

Feb 5th, 2010, 01:20 PM	#5
MannyP Design Honourable Citizen Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: New Brunswick Posts: 6,384	Seems like the pot is calling kettle black given the issues Apple has found itself in recent history. __________________ Manny \| Graphic Designer Vote for Manny and Laura in the Sony Bloggie Video Facebook Contest! Last edited by MannyP Design; Feb 5th, 2010 at 04:33 PM.

Feb 5th, 2010, 01:33 PM	#6
MannyP Design Honourable Citizen Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: New Brunswick Posts: 6,384	You have to hand it to Jobs, he's performed the oldest trick in the world flawlessly: Misdirection. I mean, this is WAY better than his reality distortion field. Jobs has passed the buck to Adobe in the hopes people will be distracted enough to forget the shortcomings of the iPad. The premise that the iPad is signaling the death of Flash is idiotic at best. Even if iPad sales break a percent of the entire computing market, it still won't put a dent in Flash usage. Jobs wants you to believe that proprietary is bad… unless it's from Apple. Next thing you know he'll blame Photoshop as the reason why Safari runs animated GIFs so bloody poorly. __________________ Manny \| Graphic Designer Vote for Manny and Laura in the Sony Bloggie Video Facebook Contest!

Feb 5th, 2010, 02:10 PM	#7
Vexel Digital DJ Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Sydney, Nova Scotia Posts: 5,284	The number one reason people think that not having flash on the iPhone/iPad is a bad idea is because of video. WIth the release of HTML5, this is going to be a moot point. Especially since it runs video so much better. I have no use for flash at all on my phone.. in fact, i can't remember the last time that i needed to run flash on a site. (for my own intentions.) This video is amazing.. for those who haven't seen it. Jilion - SublimeVideo __________________ 2.0Ghz '09 Mac Mini www.radioaddix.net

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