Is Apple going down the drain?

Boji · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:30 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by MacDoc
	http://www.tellonapple.org/ •••• There have ALWAYS been various problems with Macs - I've been there since the very beginning. The 1.8 G5 was indeed a real issue but it was mostly Apple firmware team that dropped the ball on it. Apple has been reasonable about covering design problems - the only one outstanding it the ram slot issue for Powerbook 15". I think Gartner or JD Power have stats. That magsafe story is a bit suspect - cats were involved. MBPs are certainly not noisy tho there is some issue with a bit of hiss from one of the speakers. ALL machines can fail - Apple does okay

Thanks for the reply MacDoc--perhaps it was speaker hiss, but I'm pretty sure the noise came from underneath the keyboard. Maybe it was a dud. ARGH!

MacDoc · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:35 PM

The answer is to be proactive - support the dealers and tell your friends to as well.
Go SEE it at the Apple store.
Buy locally.
That was the idea in the first plce - the stores were to be showcases not competitors.
IF the playing field was level it would be different......it's not as you see.

Apple is after Dell, plain and simple and the "channel" is incidental to that pursuit.
Most large companies have had historical issues with channel versus direct.

Boji · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:38 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by MacDoc
	The answer is to be proactive - support the dealers and tell your friends to as well. Go SEE it at the Apple store. Buy locally. That was the idea in the first plce - the stores were to be showcases not competitors. IF the playing field was level it would be different......it's not as you see. Apple is after Dell, plain and simple and the "channel" is incidental to that pursuit. Most large companies have had historical issues with channel versus direct.

It makes more sense to me if I look at it that way--the Apple Stores in malls and other prominent places is constant advertising, plus the Stores have experts that, more or less, evangelize the Windows crowd and teach us Macheads how to make better use of our computers. Thanks MacDoc.

teeterboy3 · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:42 PM

I have been a MacUser since 1984.

Number of Macs that were faulty: 1
(And, It was replaced, under warranty, with an upgraded model no cost to me)
Number of Macs I have personally owned: 5
Number of Macs that my immediate family have owned: 36

So in all the Apple products (which you can add to the above totals when you consider iPods (I have 3, my family have them too), Apple lasers & inkjet printers) I have personally seen one product fail and it was covered uner warranty. That doesn't really support your theory.

I wouldn't take the rants or 'stories' on message boards and news feeds - the soap box of our generation - as a conduit to collective, accepted reality. But more correctly as opinions of a segment of the collected whole who feel that their opinion is worth more than those they disagree with.

I see the move for the call centre really as a non sequitur. I have rarely called an Apple Call Centre in my years as an Apple user. And I think that goes for a lot of Apple users. We pride ourselves in being able to install and maintain our systems with little to no help. And the help we do need we use command question mark or the web for the answers. So what do I care if the call centre is in Moosejaw Saskatchewan or the Mars for that matter. Bottom line is, Apple is probably trying to save a few dollars. Bring down the bottom line. And as I would guess to able to price their products a little more competitively - the one thing everyone seems to bitch about. And oddly enough, now that it seems they are trying to do that, we complain that they are going down the tubes.

All-in-all I am more excited about their product line these days than I have ever been and just as assured in their quality as I have no reason to think otherwise - unless of course I was to adopt the internet sqwak-box over my own personal experiences.

I have been a Mac User and person long enough to learn one truth: For every decision to be made in life, there is a person who has no personal stake in the result, that will somehow be able to tell you why that decision was wrongly arrived at.

And the truth is, only as far as your own experience. How many Apples have you owned, and how many have failed on you?

Boji · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:55 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by teeterboy3
	I have been a MacUser since 1984. Number of Macs that were faulty: 1 (And, It was replaced, under warranty, with an upgraded model no cost to me) Number of Macs I have personally owned: 5 Number of Macs that my immediate family have owned: 36 So in all the Apple products (which you can add to the above totals when you consider iPods (I have 3, my family have them too), Apple lasers & inkjet printers) I have personally seen one product fail and it was covered uner warranty. That doesn't really support your theory. I wouldn't take the rants or 'stories' on message boards and news feeds - the soap box of our generation - as a conduit to collective, accepted reality. But more correctly as opinions of a segment of the collected whole who feel that their opinion is worth more than those they disagree with. I see the move for the call centre really as a non sequitur. I have rarely called an Apple Call Centre in my years as an Apple user. And I think that goes for a lot of Apple users. We pride ourselves in being able to install and maintain our systems with little to no help. And the help we do need we use command question mark or the web for the answers. So what do I care if the call centre is in Moosejaw Saskatchewan or the Mars for that matter. Bottom line is, Apple is probably trying to save a few dollars. Bring down the bottom line. And as I would guess to able to price their products a little more competitively - the one thing everyone seems to bitch about. And oddly enough, now that it seems they are trying to do that, we complain that they are going down the tubes. All-in-all I am more excited about their product line these days than I have ever been and just as assured in their quality as I have no reason to think otherwise - unless of course I was to adopt the internet sqwak-box over my own personal experiences. I have been a Mac User and person long enough to learn one truth: For every decision to be made in life, there is a person who has no personal stake in the result, that will somehow be able to tell you why that decision was wrongly arrived at. And the truth is, only as far as your own experience. How many Apples have you owned, and how many have failed on you?

Thanks for the post Teeterboy. You're right, the Net is the modern day equivalent of the soap box. With that in mind, however, perhaps my friends have had bad luck with their products. To answer your question, none of my Macs have failed me *knocks on wood*, but with everyone around me complaining about their Macs, I was starting to think that I was an exception more than the norm, hence why I began this thread.

I understand that Apple is bringing down their bottom line, and one way of doing is to move their call centre to India. I would just like to see Apple being able to do the same while still keeping Canadians employed.

vapour · Mar 25th, 2006, 12:58 PM

At the same time it bugs me that a lot of these resellers jack up the price as well. Locally there are only a few places to buy macs and with the exception of BestBuy there is always an add on premium. I think the small resellers have also had a bit of a monoply locally because my options have been limited, hence the higher price. Having said that the bigger corporations are out to make maxium profit and if they can control the playing field they will.

MacDoc · Mar 25th, 2006, 01:20 PM

Much of that is Apple's doing in cutting dealer margins and what they pay their dealers for service.
Retail in any electronics field is tough these days as you are competing with big box AND the internet......no easy task.

(( p g )) · Mar 25th, 2006, 01:34 PM

Electronics get more sophisticated as the cost of assembling them keeps dropping. It's not just Apple that is contending with this.

Look what $1400 will buy you today from Apple. That's less than half of what an old Mac (Lisa?) was going for in the 1980s.

UnleashedLive · Mar 25th, 2006, 01:55 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by Boji
	Who needs a stinkin' call centre!!!

The poor smuck whos computer won't turn on.

But other then that. ehmac is great

Gerbill · Mar 25th, 2006, 03:56 PM

	Quote:			Originally Posted by (( p g ))
	Electronics get more sophisticated as the cost of assembling them keeps dropping. It's not just Apple that is contending with this. Look what $1400 will buy you today from Apple. That's less than half of what an old Mac (Lisa?) was going for in the 1980s.

"Less than half" is putting it mildly. The Lisa cost just short of $10,000 US in 1983.

Mar 25th, 2006, 12:58 PM	#16
vapour Full Citizen Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Winnipeg Posts: 295	At the same time it bugs me that a lot of these resellers jack up the price as well. Locally there are only a few places to buy macs and with the exception of BestBuy there is always an add on premium. I think the small resellers have also had a bit of a monoply locally because my options have been limited, hence the higher price. Having said that the bigger corporations are out to make maxium profit and if they can control the playing field they will. __________________ http://www.flickr.com/photos/rogues-gallery/

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Mar 25th, 2006, 12:35 PM	#12
MacDoc Honourable Citizen Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Planet Earth.....on slow boil Posts: 28,102	The answer is to be proactive - support the dealers and tell your friends to as well. Go SEE it at the Apple store. Buy locally. That was the idea in the first plce - the stores were to be showcases not competitors. IF the playing field was level it would be different......it's not as you see. Apple is after Dell, plain and simple and the "channel" is incidental to that pursuit. Most large companies have had historical issues with channel versus direct.

Mar 25th, 2006, 12:42 PM	#14
teeterboy3 Full Citizen Join Date: May 2005 Location: London… the Canada one. Posts: 895	I have been a MacUser since 1984. Number of Macs that were faulty: 1 (And, It was replaced, under warranty, with an upgraded model no cost to me) Number of Macs I have personally owned: 5 Number of Macs that my immediate family have owned: 36 So in all the Apple products (which you can add to the above totals when you consider iPods (I have 3, my family have them too), Apple lasers & inkjet printers) I have personally seen one product fail and it was covered uner warranty. That doesn't really support your theory. I wouldn't take the rants or 'stories' on message boards and news feeds - the soap box of our generation - as a conduit to collective, accepted reality. But more correctly as opinions of a segment of the collected whole who feel that their opinion is worth more than those they disagree with. I see the move for the call centre really as a non sequitur. I have rarely called an Apple Call Centre in my years as an Apple user. And I think that goes for a lot of Apple users. We pride ourselves in being able to install and maintain our systems with little to no help. And the help we do need we use command question mark or the web for the answers. So what do I care if the call centre is in Moosejaw Saskatchewan or the Mars for that matter. Bottom line is, Apple is probably trying to save a few dollars. Bring down the bottom line. And as I would guess to able to price their products a little more competitively - the one thing everyone seems to bitch about. And oddly enough, now that it seems they are trying to do that, we complain that they are going down the tubes. All-in-all I am more excited about their product line these days than I have ever been and just as assured in their quality as I have no reason to think otherwise - unless of course I was to adopt the internet sqwak-box over my own personal experiences. I have been a Mac User and person long enough to learn one truth: For every decision to be made in life, there is a person who has no personal stake in the result, that will somehow be able to tell you why that decision was wrongly arrived at. And the truth is, only as far as your own experience. How many Apples have you owned, and how many have failed on you?

Mar 25th, 2006, 01:20 PM	#17
MacDoc Honourable Citizen Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Planet Earth.....on slow boil Posts: 28,102	Much of that is Apple's doing in cutting dealer margins and what they pay their dealers for service. Retail in any electronics field is tough these days as you are competing with big box AND the internet......no easy task.

Mar 25th, 2006, 01:34 PM	#18
(( p g )) Honourable Citizen Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: YOW, ON Posts: 2,211	Electronics get more sophisticated as the cost of assembling them keeps dropping. It's not just Apple that is contending with this. Look what $1400 will buy you today from Apple. That's less than half of what an old Mac (Lisa?) was going for in the 1980s.